Before — 2011
Now — 2013
First Published July 2011
Updated March 2017
Lance Goodall
Christian Nightclubs – Thou shalt party
Back in 2003, Time Magazine ran the story on a new phenomenon, The Christian Nightclub. “Club Three Degrees” in Minneapolis, Minn., boasts all the night-life staples, like pool tables, DJs and live bands. But a few things are missing, like alcohol, cigarette smoke and music with racy lyrics. That’s because the club, was the city’s first downtown Christian nightclub. Previously it was housed in an out-of-the-way spot that used to be a rock-‘n’-roll bar. “We see this as a mission,” said the Rev. Nancy Aleksuk, who has managed the club’s move to its new $3 million venue with a capacity of 1,700. 1
The relocation comes as Christian entertainment is increasing in popularity and visibility across the U.S. Russell David Hobbs, founder of “The Door”, Christian nightclubs in Dallas and Fort Worth, Texas, says his clubs have done so well he is opening a third, in Plano, Texas.2 In Hallandale Beach, Fla., more than 600 people attended the opening of Club Mighty, a once-a-month Christian nightclub created by insurance agent Sheldon Bland. “We get believers and nonbelievers,” said Bland. “People are looking for an alternative to the typical club scene.”
The controversial Hobbs describes how he took some time out, and received a greater revelation of God’s character, and a vision to bridge the gap between the church and the “secular” world. 3
Hobbs had a new revelation of God and a new vision, to mix the world and the church, like some alcoholic beverage that he doesn’t currently serve in his nightclubs. Has he forgotten that Christ and Belial have no agreement? – cf. 2 Cor 6:14 – 15. We are called to separation, from the world’s ways, the world’s pleasures, and the world’s lifestyle.
This is the new kind of thinking. This is the new breed of religious convert.
The room is black, the coloured lights flash all around. The atmosphere is electric, the laser lights glide through the room. All the youth are pumping! There is noise and hollering. The MC on stage shouts out, (just being heard) over the beat, the clamour, and cymbals; Oh yeah….this is good….this is good….you‘re dancing crazy…. I’m excited to be here — That was crazy!! What was he saying ? I don’t think he even knew what was coming next. What I just described to you was not on Sunset Strip, LA, or in a discotheque in Manhattan.
This was an in house event on August 2010, held at Hillsong Brisbane City Campus, for the young people at Powerhouse, just 18 months after Hillsong, Sydney took over the church there.4
The nightclub has been brought right into the House of God!
And it is all through the channel of music!
There is no longer any difference between the Church and the World, the devil has won!!! This type of ministry is appalling. Youth being lead by youth! These same young people come to church with alcohol on their breath from the night before, while the little ones are allowed to dress up in Halloween costumes, during the October vigil.
Meanwhile the adults are making sure they are catered to by having a rekindle the romance dinner this September, called -“ Wine Night Stand”? These themes link the event to drunkenness, and debauchery, even if it isn’t. The bible says not to even name such things among you – Cf. Eph 5:3
Such carnality is unacceptable to God, and as we shall see, is totally incongruous with the true worship of God.
Unfortunately the sins of the world are now wholly approved by a shocking number of professing Christians, Tozer declares:
“Young Christians take as their models from the rankest kind of worldlings, and try to be like them as much as possible.”5
We are being slowly poisoned. Like the lobster in the pot, the water temperature is slowly increased til it’s all too late. This tidal wave of profanity and corruption, is seeking to carry away every hint of genuine Christian community. These men are swayed by the fashion of Hollywood, and not the inner life of Christ.
Rick’s Rock Rhetoric – Saints of Los Angeles
There has been much concern voiced over the dangers and errors of contemporary Christian music, and it’s refusal to separate from secular party music, such as rock and rap. This is evident at Rick Warren’s Saddleback Church in Southern California.
In chapter 8, of The Purpose Driven Life, Warren said;
“God loves all kinds of music because he invented it all–fast and slow, loud and soft, old and new. You probably don’t like it all, but God does! … Christians often disagree over the style of music used in worship, passionately defending their preferred style as the most biblical or God-honoring. But there is no biblical style! … God likes variety and enjoys it all. There is no such thing as ‘Christian’ music; there are only Christian lyrics. It is the words that make a song sacred, not the tune. There are no spiritual tunes” (pp. 65, 66).
When Warren says that God loves all kinds of music, he means ALL kinds.
Saddleback Church features eight to nine different “worship venues on the property.” There is a worship style to suit every worldly taste.
On April 17, 2005, when Warren announced his P.E.A.C.E. program to Saddleback Church at Angel Baseball Stadium, he began by singing part of Jimi Hendrix’s drug-drenched song “Purple Haze” to the congregation, accompanied by his “praise and worship” band. He said he had wanted to do that for a long time. 6
Though he is long dead, Jimi Hendrix’s influence lives on, but it is an evil influence that should be reproved rather than encouraged. His music and his life epitomized the rock and roll philosophy, which is live as you please. Music was Jimi Hendrix’s god. He attended church in his youth, but later he testified: “I used to go to Sunday School, but the only thing I believe in now is music” (cited by Curtis Knight, Jimi).
This 442 page account outlines the strong deception that has crept into the modern church!
The book takes tackles these issues head on:https://boldlions.files.wordpress.com/2017/02/hillsong-new-cover.png
- Why is Hillsong church so dangerous?
- What Hillsong preaches is not the gospel
- Why Hillsong is promoting a false hope and a false gospel?
- Why Hillsong is no longer biblical, and has become the greatest conspiracy of our time!
- How can a church that is growing, and has so much success still be wrong?
- The book explains that Hillsong is using music to usher in the Anti-Christ.
- Why Hillsong is considered ‘Christian’, and yet is so much like the Roman Catholic church?
- What have artists like Taylor Swift, Justin Bieber Katy Perry, and Jay Z got to do with Hillsong?
- ……and much more.
The author takes you on a journey through recent developments in Hillsong’s musicology, and shows the dangers of not examining or questioning. The book uncovers the dark secrets behind this seemingly innocent church. The book reads more like a ‘Doco-drama’ than Non-Fiction, and provides a unique insight into the church on the downgrade.
Get 3 formats (PDF and Kindle, and Epub) for the one great price or buy individually!
Hellsong – See Inside
Watch Video Trailer
Article: contd….
Hendrix understood the mystical and hypnotic power of rock music. He said:
“Atmospheres are going to come through music, because the music is a spiritual thing of its own. … I can explain everything better through music. You hypnotize people to where they go right back to their natural state, which is pure positive-like childhood when you got natural highs. And when you get people at weakest point, you can preach into the subconscious what we want to say. That’s why the name ‘electric church’ flashes in and out” (Hendrix, interview with Robin Richman “An Infinity of Jimis,” Life magazine, Oct. 3, 1969).
“Once you have some type of rhythm, like it can get hypnotic if you keep repeating it over and over again. You do that say for three or four or even five minutes if you can stand it, and then it releases a certain thing inside of a person’s head.It releases a certain thing in there so you can put anything you want right inside that, you know. i always like to take people on trips. that’s why music is magic.” (Hendrix, cited by Henderson, p. 356).
Rick Warren inadvertently agrees with the construct of music like Hendrix, “A song can often touch people in ways a sermon can’t. Music can bypass intellectual barriers and take the message straight to the heart. It’s a potent tool for evangelism.”7
These are observations, and warnings that should be taken seriously by Christians. Though Hendrix was a licentious drug user, he was also a brilliant and gifted musician and he understood the nature of rock music as few men have. Those who think that there is no spiritual danger in rock music are deceiving themselves and are leading others down the primrose path of delusion. Observe that Hendrix was referring to the power of the music itself without the words.
It is therefore inexcusable for Rick Warren and his “worship” team to perform any Jimi Hendrix song on any occasion whatsoever. The use of the song was inappropriate, carnal, and says a lot about Warren on a number of levels.
There is a long history of no separation from the world at Saddleback Church. Any sorry piece of rock or rap music is fine as long as it is accompanied by a thin veneer of religiosity.
Under the Worship section of Saddleback Church’s web site there is a “School of Music and Arts,” where you can learn to play in a band. “The best way to learn is to play with other “rockers” like you! “
This is “worship”, Rick Warren style’8
The Celebrity Driven Church – Sold Out Jesus
Hillsong Music is Christian music produced by Hillsong Church in Sydney Australia. Their albums are released and distributed by Hillsong Music Australia, the resource arm of Hillsong Church. Hillsong is one of the world’s fastest-growing ministries, with a 25,000-plus strong congregation in Australia, as well as one of the largest evangelical churches in London, Cape Town and Kiev. Hillsong also has churches in Stockholm and Paris, and recently established a new church in New York City.10
For that past twenty years Hillsong worship music has been a global phenomenon. The songs from Hillsong church in Sydney, Australia—with their quirky punk rhythms and euro pop harmonies—are sung around the world. You can even find Hillsong CDs in small town Lutheran bookstores, as I did recently.
Hillsong popularity in Christian praise and worship music stems from the inauguration of their conferences, in the late 1980s, and the first publication of choruses written by Hills CLC members, especially Darlene Zschech. Their first live worship CD “The Power of your Love” was released in 1992. Since then, live praise and worship albums have been produced each year. Other music series include the Worship series, United, Youth Alive, Hillsong Kids and Instrumental series, as two Christmas albums and several compilation albums.[1]
Since its first release in 1988, Hillsong has recorded more than 60 albums, including live worship, and kids and youth CDs. They have been distributed in 80 countries and collected more than 30 gold and platinum awards in Australia and the U.S.11 Total revenue of Christian music in Australia in 2004: $30.2 million 12 Ok, actually it’s pretty obvious: the people in the band and all their fans are gorgeous and hip! They spend time in airports and travel the world looking cool, wearing shades and sporting The Clash t-shirts. Image is the name of the game.
The Hillsong United band is a praise and worship band that originated as a part of Hillsong. The band tours the world, performing at the various Hillsong church locations as well as general concert venues. The music style now is known as ‘Hard Worship’ or ‘Rock Worship’.13
Dr. Mark Evans (Macquarie University) states in his Ph. D thesis, “A youth band was formed from the Hillsong music team, which took what was happening in the church musically and played it louder and rockier, appealing directly to a youth demographic”.14
The Christian music industry is now celebrity driven. The is totally irrelevant. The focus is on the person, and the songs have become disposable.
Most of our ills can be directed at this circus of Christian Entertainment. These new “Christians” know nothing of seeking God. We are now seeing a crisis among today’s youth.
Today much of this error is flooding into the church under the guise of “relevance”. In the name of ‘relevance’ we are rushing around desperately trying to make our music “cool” and our leadership “cool” and our gospel “cool” and our youth events “cool”,- all in an effort to attract the world on its terms. Instead of “holier than thou”, we are”cooler than thou”. Our whole effort is aimed at proving to the world that Christianity is just as cool, just as much fun, just as much of a party, as the world has to offer. We feel we have to become just like the world, in order to impress the world. Thus, we now need to be seen in fashionable (or better-still, ‘hip’ or alternative) clothes. And our youth events become an excuse for a “party”. And our presentations become entertaining multi-media extravaganzas.
This is all in an effort to be equal, or “out-cool” the world. Which is why you now see ‘moshing’ heads, slam-dancing, and stage-diving at our youth concerts, – matching the world’s mindless hedonistic ways. We have become “Lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God”. Being cool, yet full of pride, worldliness, and rebellion – all in the name of “relevance”
There is a real danger of the emergence of the ‘Concert Christian’, the semi-converted, shallow committed teenager whose Christianity means little more than that he enjoys festival-going.”
And the tragic fact is, that such ‘Concert Christians’ are now found in their multiplied thousands,
around the globe. It is not just the large festivals, and concerts, that have succumbed to this spirit of entertainment. 15a
We now find this ‘entertain-them-at-all-costs’ approach to youth ministry everywhere, from local church youth right up to large regional gatherings. This spirit has pervaded everything, particularly those areas in the church that are connected with young people. In fact, it has become increasingly rare to find gatherings of Christian youth now in which these attitudes do not prevail.
Many Christians may not realize that in America, every one of the major Christian music companies is now owned by a secular corporation. EMI owns Sparrow, Starsong, Forefront and Gospocentric, Gaylord Entertainment owns Word Records, and the Zomba Group owns Benson Music, Brentwood Music and the Reunion label.
You cannot serve God and EMI – Takin’ care of Business
Hillsong’s Music industry(HMI) has joined forces with EMI. In April 2010 EMI CMG Label Group and its Sparrow Records label started marketing and developing Hillsong Music annual releases, including the best-selling Hillsong LIVE, Hillsong UNITED, and Hillsong Kids recordings, as well as their other music and video products. The plan is to extend its reach into North and South America. 15
It raises the all important question as to whether these Christian labels are now essentially profit-driven or ministry-driven entities. And it also gives a pointer to just how much MONEY is involved in the Christian music industry today.
Today the largest Christian publishers are owned by secular corporations or have shares held by Wall Street investors. As ministries turn into big businesses, theological integrity can easily give way to marketing considerations…
The Christian marketplace thus follows the lead of the world’s pop culture. A common saying in the industry is,” Whenever a trend emerges in the secular arena, wait six months and a Christianized version will appear in the religious bookstores.”
The early songs of Hillsong such as Power Of Your Love (1992) covered some basic Christian themes. An acknowledgment of God, the need to change, our weaknesses, God’ grace, our need for Him, the power of God’s love to forgive and overcome in our lives.
But in this past decade, we have seen a steady well orchestrated decline into the worship of entertainment.
Hillsong United – Break Free (Abridged) 2007
Would you believe me, would you listen if I told you that
There is a love that makes a way and never holds you back?
So won’t you break free, won’t you break free
Get up and dance in his love (repeat)
Who would have thought that God would give His one and only Son
Taking a stand up on the cross to show his perfect love?
Now we have a Christ, whose love doesn’t hold us back, and a love that is “taking a stand” on the cross. When you look at the importance of songs in conveying a message, this song falls far short of the traditional Christian canon. In fact, it is downright repugnant!
Christ paid our price on the cross. He took our place. He took our penalty for sin, and received the very wrath of God poured out on him. He died a physical death, as the Eternal God, He who had no beginning, ever present with the Father, he was cut off for the first time from God. He who knew no sin was made sin for us. He endured agony, emotionally, physically and spiritually. All for us!!
Not quite the same as “making a stand”, to show His love.
“Christ demonstrated his love, that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.” -Romans 5:1
“For the love of Christ constrains us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: and that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.”– (2 Cor. 5:14, 15)
The Cross and the Phoenix – Talking up the cross
Hillsong United have just released a new studio album – called “Aftermath” – 15 Feb 2011
When I read this title, I was disturbed, and questioned the name with a great deal of unease.
Definition
“Aftermath”
The meaning of the word aftermath is linked to the consequences of an event (especially a catastrophic event); “the aftermath of war”; in the wake of the accident no one knew how many had been injured. A consequence, especially of a disaster or misfortune: famine as an aftermath of drought.
Aftermath, by the way, doesn’t feature as a word in the bible. Back in 2001 Youth Alive produced an album called – Elevate. Again Elevate is not a word in found in the bible .It is a term linked to evolution and the ascendancy of man, and is found in Masonic literature.
Let me make it loud and clear, the cross of Christ and His choosing to go there has nothing to do with Greek or Roman tragedy, calamity, or some sort of cosmic fallout. Christ, on the cross declared, it is finished! He was not the Christ, Mary Magdalene, and the disciples thought he was. To them, his death was a tragedy. All their hopes and dreams lay silent with the Lord in the tomb. But — he the Son of God, rose up that Sunday morn, conquering the grave, just as he said!
“For You will not leave my soul in Sheol, nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.” – Ps 16:10
The Lord Jesus did not experience decay or ruin.
“And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them in it.” – Col 2:15
Christ rose from the dead, and is now seated at the right hand of God. He has defeated death, sin and the devil. Let me repeat this so I’m clear – there is no aftermath with God, and there are no surprises. He makes all things new –Hallelujah!!
The unusual name of the Album, and single, are even more pronounced by its association with other songs of the same title.
Other Songs entitled – Aftermath 16
- “Aftermath” (R.E.M. song)
- “Aftermath”, by Adam Lambert from For Your Entertainment 2009
- “Aftermath”, by Edge of Sanity from Crimson II
- “Aftermath”, by Phish from Phish
- “Aftermath”, by The Rolling Stones; an unreleased song credited to Nanker Phelge
- “Aftermath”, by Sonic Syndicate from Only Inhuman
- “The Aftermath”, by Bob Seger and the Silver Bullet Band from Like a Rock
- “The Aftermath”, by Iron Maiden from The X Factor
- “The Aftermath”, by Kashmir from Zitilites
- “The Aftermath”, by Origin from Antithesis 2008
- “The Aftermath (G3)”, by Escape the Fate from Escape the Fate Nov 2010
Adam Lambert, (listed above), this modern Elvis look- a- like, had photos surface showing him romantically kissing another man while he was competing on the eighth season of American Idol. Lambert confirmed that the photos were of him, stating he had nothing to hide and has always been open about his life.[31] Mainstream media speculation centred on Lambert’s sexuality; presuming he was gay, he would be the first gay American Idol.[32 17
He recently appeared on Australian idol as a guest singer.
Lambert released his album “For your entertainment” in Nov 2009, but “The Aftermath” Remix single is being released in March of this year. The timing, with Hillsong United’s release date of February 2011 for their album, raises some speculation that it was more than a coincidence.
If you research the above list most of the groups are either – rock, hard rock, metal, heavy metal.
Origin is a Technical death metal band!!
How can a seemingly innocent title of a song stir up some much questionable connections and controversy?? There must more to the name than meets the eye.
Aftermath –Feb 2011 (abridged lyrics)
In a moment of glorious surrender You were broken for all the world to see Lifted out of the ashes I am found in the aftermath
The above lyrics are taken from the single “aftermath” by Hillsong United.
Firstly I want to say these lyrics seem as though they were intended to be metaphorical. However there must be concern over lyrics that refer to Christ’s death as an aftermath. Christ’s death can no way be considered a disaster, or some human tragedy.
Christ’s death was a propitiation for our sins, to deal with God’s righteous justice against our sin and rebellion. His death was part of the overall plan of salvation. Christ the victor gives us life through His life. In no way do we come forth anew, raised out from Christ’s death, or from Christ’s ashes? If that was what was meant, then the analogy smacks of a modern day take on reincarnation.
We are buried in Christ, and we are raised again with him. Cf.- Romans 6: 4 – 11
4 “Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. “
To be” lifted out of the ashes” is a weighted reference to the Phoenix. The Phoenix bird symbolizes rebirth, especially of the sun, and has variants in European, Central American, Egyptian and Asian cultures. In the 19th century, Hans Christian Anderson wrote a story about the phoenix. Edith Nesbit features a phoenix in one of her children’s stories, The Phoenix and the Carpet, as does J.K. Rowling in the ‘Harry Potter’ series. In one volume of Harry Potter, the phoenix does its resurrecting routine. JK Rowling wrote Harry Potter and the order of the Phoenix in 2003
A new phoenix always rises from the ashes. 18
Manly P. Hall, in his book entitled, The Secret Destiny of America, 1958, p. 176-177 wrote:
“All symbols have their origin in something tangible, and the Phoenix is one sign of the secret orders of the ancient world, and of the initiate of those orders, for it was common to refer to one who had been accepted into temples as a man twice-born, or reborn. Wisdom confers a new life, and those who become wise are born again.”
A former witch had to say regarding the occult belief in the Phoenix Bird. “The Phoenix… is believed to be a divine bird going back to Egypt… This Phoenix destroys itself in flames and then rises from the ashes. Most occultists believe that the Phoenix is a symbol of Lucifer who was cast down in flames and who they think will one day rise triumphant. This, of course, also relates to the rising Hiram Abiff, the Masonic ‘Christ.’ [Source: Dr. C. Burns, Masonic and Occult Symbols Illustrated, p. 123]
Thus what we have here is a bird, the occult Phoenix Bird that has its root in Ancient mythology. It actually symbolizes the New Age concept of being born-again.19
It is synonymous with the rising of a “New World Order” as illustrated in detail, on the back of the United States One dollar bill. The new order rises up out of the ashes of the old regime.
The Lotus flower, the egg, the swastika, and the Ying Yang, are all symbols for birth and rebirth.20
These symbols of rebirth, and the “phoenix” alluded to in Hillsong United’s “Aftermath” is totally misguided, linking Christian thought with new age mythology and symbolism. And just to make sure I wasn’t reading into this song, I read on and found these additional lyrics….
And in that moment You opened up the heavens To the broken the beggar and the thief Lifted out of the wreckage I find hope in the aftermath
It is this merging of two ideas or philosophies into a homogenised heterodoxy. We are quickly departing from the faith, and we don’t even know it!
This same theme of chaos and disorder have become overarching ‘doctrine’ within Hillsong to the point last year ( July 2013) a new album “Glorious Ruins” again trumpeted this theme of ruin and decay. This is not Christian doctrine, and yet Brian Houston on the DVD Collector edition gave a 25 min message on the New Age Pseudo Resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ!
See article — https://coercioncode.com/2013/07/03/glorious-ruins-hillsong/
It is ironic that at the writing of this article, Hillsong United are having their most successful concerts in the United States ever! They are selling out tickets, by selling out Jesus, and the message of the gospel.
Now some 3 years later they have planted a church in New York, and Benjamin Houston, pastor at Hillsong Church, Sydney, Australia and son of its founders Brian and Bobbie Houston, has announced that the first gathering for the new church plant in Los Angeles.
The pastor further explained that the first Hillsong LA gathering would be an opportunity for supporters “to meet/hang out/have fun” (that’s all they do anyway) with each other and some members of the church team he is leading with his wife will take place at the end of January 2014.
A New Salvation – – Highway to Hell
One of the most tragic aspects of this ongoing departing is the reality that the whole world lies in the hands of the evil one. Condemned in darkness, and spiritual blindness, our condition is such that the devil has blinded the eyes of unbelievers. We are born part of this world system, dead in trespasses and sin, cut off from God, hostile and wayward in our response to Him.
Without God’s intervention we are eternally lost, set on a course for Hell and destruction. Without God, we are without hope in the world. Yet the majority of the church wants to use the methods of the world to bring about the new birth. Who do we fool? We massage the message, and manipulate the multitudes, using natural means like rock music to bring about spiritual outcomes. There can be no new birth, no new creation, no sanctification apart from the life and activity of the Holy Spirit. This use of worldly concepts only brings about false conversions, dare I say, “still births”.
Our growth over the last three decades has been nothing more than the work of man on the back of a philistine cart. With the church in decline, someone decided to keep the ark from falling, by the introduction of marketing, and a man centred gospel, but we have touched the Holy. Though we have seen this way sweep the world, there has been no change, no repentance, no fleeing from the wrath to come, just come to Jesus, and pray a simple prayer. The Holy Spirit’s influence is more or less ceased. Instead we use the world’s music, theatre and other forms of entertainment to draw men, which is nothing more than appealing to the carnal.
The Homosexual community tapped into this idea years ago, with their annual Mardi Gras. Give the people what they want, fun, and entertainment, and we will make them believe our lifestyle is acceptable. The church is using the same worldly methods without blushing.
Today true salvation is rarely understood. We have gone down the slippery slope of offering the masses a repackaged modern day version of Catholicism. Atonement is now defined as a forgiving of yourself. Emerging is a Romish reformation of form and flattery. God’s wonderful plan for our lives according to scripture is, death to self, denying the flesh, taking the path of suffering, the cross, with its shame.
Instead we feed the prodigals the husk of health, wealth, and prosperity, cheap grace, your best life now, while still leaving them wallowing in their pigpen. We have preached the message of a “Golden Ticket”, a Christ purchased salvation, so we can live as we please, our best life here, and our best life there.
We are fulfilling Christ’s words again in our generation, going across seas to make proselytes twice the sons of hell we are. Robert Schuller, and his band of reformers have blazed a trail that is bringing in a new dawn of apostasy. Grieved men who put no trust in the flesh cannot stand by and watch this storm of deception roll in.
Culture Club – Church of the Poisoned mind
We have given in to the culture of celebrity. We have fallen into the error of Lucifer who became proud of his place and position, within God’s Hierarchy. How many men of God have allowed power, and position in their ministry to corrupt God’s purposes? And this is the whole reason we have the decay and this crowds by any means mania in the first place. This world is all about money, fame and fortune, and all its vices in between. How then can the church take that which is tainted by the world, and use it for the kingdom of God, except we have fallen backwards.
Yet again with all the brash sacrilege it could muster, Hillsong put on an end of year musical production of “Someone has stolen the Star”, this last December, based on the theme of Christmas!? 25 They included characters such as Mr. Incredible, Gingerbread Man, Tooth-fairy, Batman and Superman along with Santa Clause to present to us the meaning and message of Christmas – that Jesus was God’s present from God to us?
Have I missed something? There is also the story of Cinderella thrown in. But isn’t that a story of romance? And there you have it. Love and romance are the drawcard, not the nativity scene, with its serenity, reverence, and wonder over the Son of God come to earth. No – were over that! That’s been done. Give us something different, something new! Let’s make it all about a girl who’s down on her luck, a mere after thought, until the prince comes to bring her hope. You know; a good old tale of rags to riches. This was a production that Glee would be proud of. To the casual observer it was all about the entertainment. Oh, by the way there were some carols thrown in. It was billed as a church service, but tickets were sold, so it was all about the money. By their fruit you shall know them. We need more of the Holy Spirit, not more money. It is because we have no Holy Spirit, that we need more money.
When are we going to wake up? Making the gospel a vehicle of enterprise! Do we no longer read our bibles? Will Jesus not come again, take up the cords in His hands, and throw over our tables of merchandise, and marketing? It’s only a matter of time – See 2 Peter 2: 1 – 3
Twilight Christians – Nights on the Broadway
Brian and Bobbie Houston at one time had this vision. “I see a Church whose heartfelt praise and worship touches heaven and changes earth. With worship that exalts Jesus Christ through powerful songs of faith and hope. I see a Church whose altars are constantly filled with repentant sinners responding to His call to salvation.
Yes, the Church that I see is so dependent on the Holy Spirit that nothing will stop it, nor stand against it. A Church, whose people are unified, praying, and full of Spirit-filled believers.” 22
We can now say that we have produced nothing close to repentant sinners, dependent on the Holy Spirit, praying, Spirit-filled believers, mentioned by Brian and Bobbie Houston, but instead a brood of twilight Christians, living half in the world and half in Christ. Dancing with the devil in the name of Christ, divided in the twilight of commitment, and conviction, nightclubs, and disco halls, Usher and United. We have Christians facing both ways, halted by two opinions, enjoying Christ and the world. We become enemies of God, but that no longer seems to matter, the warning falling on deaf ears. We cry, God will not reject his people? – cf. 1 Sam 12:14 -25
When I was still part of Hillsong, I would hear the leaders talk about the upcoming “Encounter” weekend. This was where over 140 young people would get together to meet God. You know, to set aside the weekend, to seek God, and be filled with His Holy Spirit! But not as you would anticipate. A youtube clip of the weekend (Oct 2010) , leaves you dismayed and heartbroken.22 Once more the room is pitch black, the coloured lights flash all around. The green strobe laser lights, the crowded room, the youth pumping! The noise, the beat and licentious sound. We have made entertainment the new god. Like Xbox, Wii, and every other form of self gratification, we have replaced the true God, with a god we are comfortable with. We do not know what has become of this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, make for us gods we can worship, after the gods of Egypt. ( – see Ex 32:1)
Young & Free — Real Love — The new nightclub worship
Satan has Entered the Building
Satanic Church Anyone? – Hillsong London 2016 Easter
Like the children of Israel, in the wilderness of sin, we have Christianized our idolatry, and sanctified our blasphemy. We do not know what has become of this Moses (type of Jesus), we cannot see Him, or touch Him, so the cry is “make for us gods we can worship, the gods we know, that we are familiar with.” So we bow to the gods of this world. We rock with the best of them, and get away with as much as is socially acceptable. If it’s not mentioned in the bible then we should be fine. Everything else goes, and the values that Christ scorned, are being used to attract people to the gospel today.
It’s one thing for the world to go head long into Hell, but for the church to follow suit is complete madness. We are close to losing our evangelical birthright!
Worship in these churches, like Hillsong has become nothing more than a sanctified nightclub, without the booze and ecstasy. In fact it can no longer be called worship, but strange fire in the nostrils of an angry God. The sanctuary has become so denigrated that the gods of Moloch and Dagon are at home. The church has become a synagogue of Satan. God created us to be worshippers of Him, but we have corrupted the music, and made the “worship” into entertainment, about us, and for us. Hillsong in particular has churned out song after song, love ditties, lyrics nothing more than what you would hear on secular radio, the product of a Christless Christianity. The standard is so low that Van Halen, and Keith Urban could be Christian. You are hard pressed now to find “Jesus” his name at all mentioned in any of the new “worship” songs. Its “You”. We have a lot of biblical language, but not necessarily anything biblical.
These new worship songs could easily be sung to a girlfriend/boyfriend as to Jesus. Over the last decade this style of lyric has become part of the ever-expanding “Jesus Is My Girlfriend” genre.
Take out the line “I’ve got a Saviour and He’s living in me” and “What The World Will Never Take” is one of those songs: You would never really know it’s about Jesus:
One of the most obvious signs that there is no worship in the Church, is that true worship requires the humbling and prostrating of ourselves before a holy God, who dwells in unapproachable light. Isaiah’s God is not our God. Worship today is nothing more than Pentecostal X Factor. The Pentecostals and Evangelicals of this current dark hour have become the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Judas Iscariots, worrying only about the poor, and the money bags. True worship has been relegated to a non essential for the modern Christian. We know nothing of worship except, the putting on a religious rock concert. We now have the worship team run by session musicians and an assorted corral of dixie chicks.23
The Worship of Entertainment – Your own personal Jesus
We have talked about revival to the point we should have turned the world upside down by now, but let me say it, God cannot and will not send clouds of revival to a stubborn, hard hearted, stiff necked people. We have made church a party playground for prodigals instead a place of prayer. There has been no repentance, no sackcloth, nor ashes, instead we have had our revivals that have brought nothing but Bentley bedlam, Houston Heterodoxy, and Hinn Hysteria. These impostors, clouds without rain, and others like them, have brought God’s judgement of deception, and drought of the word of God to God’s people. In fact the extent of this rift is such that it has been a systematic tearing down of the foundations of our faith. We have desecrated the temple with our own bare hands! We have committed two sins before God, forsaking Him – the fountain of living waters, and digging cisterns for ourselves, broken cisterns that hold no water. We have chosen to dig for our own water, when Christ the living waters, has been our source, all the time.
We have made music and entertainment our new refreshment. In heightened treachery we have carried on our programmes regardless.
Regardless of what style of worship, the music and lyrics have left God out of the picture.
Tozer said “we took a downward trend when we left the great objective hymns that talked about God, and began to sing the Gospel songs that talk about us. There was the day when men sang “Holy Holy, Holy”, and “O worship the King”… then we backslide into the gutter where we still are, where everything is about I. “I’m so happy”, “ I’m so blest”,” I’m so good”, ……always I. The difference between Heaven and Hell is the difference between God and I. Jesus Christ by cancelling his “I”, was the Christ of God, not as I will, but as thou wilt. ..”. (Sermon: Ezekiel)
It was this reality of singing the mantra of “man centred” worship, that woke me up to the need to reassess my being involved long term with Hillsong Church. I was standing on stage one Sunday morning, up in the choir, singing about freedom, and my heart changed the words so that I could lift praise to God instead. I left 6 months later.
Christian Metal in diverse places – on shaky ground
Within the world of Rock-n-Roll, and specifically in heavy metal bands, musicians are idolized. These bands promote immorality, Satanism, suicide, sadomasochism and masochistic behaviour, drug abuse, obscene language, and even direct blasphemy of God and His Holy name.
In the 1980’s, Christian metal-glam rockers Stryper, pranced around wearing mascara, lip gloss, eye shadow, earrings, spandex and women’s hair styles, deliberately mocking 1 Cor. 6:9-10 (“No effeminate. . . shall inherit the kingdom of God”). Stryper’s popularity and perversion of Christian music garnished a Contemporary Christian Music (CCM)-record-breaking, two platinum and four gold records!
Robert Sweet of Styrper, makes a startling admission about Christian rock in RIP magazine:
“As a matter of fact, the band was one thing that was making us turn and walk the opposite direction from Christianity. . . If you’re doing something you like doing, and God says not to do it, then you’re not going to pay attention.”(RIP, April, 1987 p. 49) 24
Tim Gaines of Stryper, revealed to HM magazine,
“From the end of 1988 ‘til February of this year [1997], I was drunk every day.” (HM Magazine, Mar/Apr 97 #64, p.47)
“We’re not religious fanatics who are trying to convert everybody we meet.. .We honestly believe that Jesus Christ is the Savior, but we’re about the most unreligious Christian band you could imagine. . . ” Robert Sweet, of Stryper (Hit Parader Nov, 1986, p. 21)
Stryper’s latest 2011 CD are covers that run the gamut from 1970’s era classic rock (Led Zeppelin’s “Immigrant Song,” Deep Purple’s “Highway Star,” Kiss’ “Shout It Out Loud,” etc.) to 1980’s era of heavy metal (Black Sabbath’s “Heaven and Hell,” the Scorpions’ “Blackout,” “Iron Maiden’s “The Trooper,” etc.).
That’s right you read it correctly – They are doing covers of Christ hating heavy metal bands – these men are deceivers! They have never turned away, but instead have returned to their vomit.
We must agree with the word of God that by their fruit you will know them. What fruit is the tree of Heavy Metal producing? From the frank admissions above, these men were not able to make any solid commitment to Christ. We now begin to see that music is more than a few tunes, and some lyrics. Music moves men’s souls for good, or for bad.
So we have this other branch of the contemporary wild stock – Planetshakers. They are a Christian youth movement that began as an annual conference in 1997, and grew into an international ministry and large church in Melbourne, Australia.
The conference was born out of Paradise Community Church South Adelaide, Australia run by Pastor Russell Evans, – “Planetshakers” expanded, and in 2004 moved to Melbourne to begin a church ministry. The 2003 Australian Idol winner Guy Sebastian was part of the Planetshakers band for several years, taking both lead and backup vocal parts on the 2002 and 2003 albums and conferences
Their stated mission is to “empower a generation to win a generation”.26
They may have produced some songs of intensity, and dedication over their short history to bring to a new group of young people a glimpse of God. They may have begun in sincerity, and with a zeal for God, but in the last few years they have quickly pushed through all plausible barriers of legitimate Christian worship, and have the rest of the church careering down a cliff of musical genres – hard rock, heavy rock, metal, thrashing Guitars, and club mix. They have become a mild softer version of Stryper.
This group of young people have produced their own personal Jesus.
The methodology of the modern Church, has raised up a new breed of demigods, young people still caught up in the idolatries of the media, and music worlds, who have come from obscurity into stardom, on the back of today’s Christian music. Gone are the days of not putting novices in places of leadership and responsibility. A young convert no longer wants to follow Christ, “The cross before me, the world behind me”, but coverts the place of the Christian Rock Star
Planetshakers recent songs, “Jump around”, “Get Up”, and “Dance now”, “Boom” have all the hallmarks of Bon Jovi, Metallica, Guns ‘n Roses, AC/DC, and Nirvana, the modern equivalent of groups – We are Kings, Friday Night Boys, and The Downtown Fiction, all Pop Punk, Alternative Rock, and Power Pop bands .Their performances are now fully fledged concerts with all the equipment – LED panels, Light show, smoke, and guitars, amps, keyboard, and drums. These stage sets cost thousands of dollars.27
Planetshakers’ Pastor Rob Bradbury says, “It’s important that we connect with youth culture,” 28
But a recent blog said;
ROCK ON!!!!
I love this song!!
I am a guitarist!!
and that’s the reason I love the Planetshakers!! Because most of your songs are rock type!! and I love rock music!!
So much for reaching this generation!
Now metal is mainstream!
We should have no appearance of evil, we should reprove, not approve of darkness!
These albums of Hillsong, and Planetshakers are now all over world! It seems like this musical mayhem has spread like a cancer.
And supposedly all this “great music” from the shores of Australia!
We have become rebellious people, reprobate silver, undisciplined children.
(See Heb 12: 6-8, Jeremiah 6: 10 – 30)
To whom shall I speak, and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ear is uncircumcised, and they cannot hearken: behold, the word of the LORD is unto them a reproach; they have no delight in it. … 17Also I set watchmen over you, saying, Hearken to the sound of the trumpet. But they said, We will not hearken. ….28They are all grievous revolters, walking with slanders: they are brass and iron; they are all corrupters. 29The bellows are burned, the lead is consumed of the fire; the founder melts in vain: for the wicked are not plucked away.
30Reprobate silver shall men call them, because the LORD hath rejected them…
Hear, O heavens, and give ear, O earth: for the LORD hath spoken, I have nourished and brought up children, and they have rebelled against me. -Isaiah 1:2 (KJV)
Satan’s Saints Rock Rocketown –Each man a god unto himself
Michael W. Smith’s Rocketown Franklin, TN, and downtown Nashville, part nightclub, part coffeehouse, and part activities centre, for young people, held a night of heavy metal bands in 2009. The club’s mission: to share “Christ’s love with youth through creative programs and mentoring relationships that are culturally relevant and eternally significant.” Rocketown’s website is full of references to ministry and Christ.
Yet Rocketown hosted a night of Hardcore Satanic Metal bands on Oct 27th, 2009, with a lineup that included – The Black Dahlia Murder, Toxic Holocaust, Skeltonwitch, and Trap Them.
One of the bands, Toxic Holocaust, says in their bio that they have a “deadly fixation on the evil in man and a post-apocalyptic world” and their songs are “unforgettable anthems that could be the soundtrack to civil unrest in a post-apocalyptic world gone mad.” That might explain their song -“Nuke The Cross.”29
Did you pick up on what they said “a post –apocalyptic world” or a world in the aftermath of destruction, and devastation!
To have these young kids come to hear about Christ, and then giving them a lineup of bands who hate Christ is beyond comprehension.
I don’t want to say it —- “but I told you so” We have come full circle.
This is where we will all end up, at the bottom of the spiritual cliff. If we do not repent and follow the old paths, and walk in them, we will have lost the fight. All this is serving God with strange fire that He never condoned or permitted! We have been going in the way of Cain bringing unacceptable worship. We bring to God worship from lives that have never been placed under the blood.
God has given us over to believing a lie – We are under God’s judgement!
Psalm 81: 8-12 KJV
Hear, O my people, and I will testify unto thee: O Israel, if thou wilt hearken unto me;
9There shall no strange god be in thee; neither shalt thou worship any strange god.
10I am the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt: open thy mouth wide, and I will fill it.
11But my people would not hearken to my voice; and Israel would none of me.
12So I gave them up unto their own hearts’ lust: and they walked in their own counsel.
Did you hear what God said? If we had sought Him, he would have given us the lyrics, the sound, the songs to sing. But we chose to drink from a different font, a different stream.
A different Jesus, a different spirit, a different” Godspell”
Remember Rick Warren’s rhetoric – “There is no such thing as ‘Christian’ music; there are only Christian lyrics.”
Now we have neither!
In his article, “match the music to the people,” Rick Warren goes onto say, “It’s the words that make a song spiritual. If I were to play a tune for you without any words, you wouldn’t know if it was a Christian song or not.” 30
Has he never watched a Metallica concert?
Listen again to the prophetic words of Jimi Hendrix
“Atmospheres are going to come through music, because the music is a spiritual thing of its own ….you hypnotize people…. That’s why the name ‘electric church’ flashes in and out” (Hendrix, interview with Robin Richman “An Infinity of Jimis,” Life magazine, Oct. 3, 1969).
There is a solemn warning here that the church has not heeded. Atmospheres are going to come, and one of the major vehicles through which it will come to this new generation of young rockers, is through the Electric Church. The Church of God playing the music of the world, in the name of God! Deceived by seducing spirits, we now are no longer in control of the way the music is going.
When they introduced this new type of music, but it was never just to have a new style of music, it was to lead us away from everything sacred, and everything that had a scriptural basis.
2 Corinthians 11: 1 – 4 I hope you will put up with a little of my foolishness; but you are already doing that. I am jealous for you with a godly jealousy. I promised you to one husband, to Christ, so that I might present you as a pure virgin to him. But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent’s cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ. For if someone comes to you and preaches a Jesus other than the Jesus we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it easily enough.
Whatever the inspiration for the music and with its subsequent industry, that has produced album after album, year after year, we know that something has changed in the attitude, style, lyrics and overall message of the music.
Receiving “another” Jesus also entails the receiving of a “different spirit” (v. 4b). And if the “Jesus” they believe and the “Spirit” they receive, are not the ones Paul preached then clearly the “gospel” they have embraced is false and damning!
There isn’t “another” Jesus. There’s only one.
These heavy metal bands have become the new benchmark of inspiration for the modern church. This rampant deterioration brings a deep sense of foreboding, when reflecting on the sound and the lyrics now coming out of the Hillsong , and Planetshakers music machine.
A different spirit is now taking over!
2 Corinthians 11: 12 – 15
12And what I do I will continue to do, in order to undermine the claim of those who would like to claim that in their boasted mission they work on the same terms as we do. 13For such men are(Y) false apostles,deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. 14And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. 15So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds.
Why are we pushing the envelope? Or perhaps a better question who is pushing the envelope?
Guy and that Girl – Tattoos and Parables
Australia’s latest Christian sensations Brook Fraser and Guy Sebastian have gained success in the secular charts, with the fans, as well as respect from the world. It’s called — influence. God calls it apostasy and backsliding.
Guy spent his formidable years at Adelaides Paradise City Church. In 2003 one of Paradise’s worship leaders Guy Sebastian became the inaugural winner of Australian Idol.
On his rise to success Guy got himself a tattoo. The bible condemns the branding, or marking of our body.“ Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.” – Leviticus 19:28.
Guy got the tattoo in 2009 – So what was his tattoo? You guessed it, a Phoenix!
No doubt an attempt to toughen up his boy-next-door image as he continues to court fans in the US, Guy spent hours in an artist’s chair getting his phoenix design filled in.
You can spot irrefutable evidence a society has embraced Satanic values in many ways, but the visible evidence of multiple body piercings and tattoos are the strongest of all. Few people understand the use Satan makes of piercing and tattoos to control the person!
Chris Brown (American R&B Singer) and Todd Bentley (evangelist/ preacher Lakeland Revival, FL) are two obvious examples why you don’t get a tattoo!
A tattoo is the latest fashion statement within the teen and youth culture driven by celebrities, and pop stars.
Joel Houston worship leader with Hillsong United has a tattoo on his upper right arm.
Famous witch and author Laurie Cabot writes of the tattoo:
“The origins of tattooing came from ancient magical practices.” (Laurie Cabot, Power of the Witch, cited in Masonic and Occult Symbols Illustrated by Dr. Cathy Burns, p. 301) 32
Even today, in many countries (including the United States), the tattoo is believed to be a bridge into the supernatural world.
Brook Fraser spoke in an interview regarding her position on being Christian music artist;
She doesn’t want to merchandise the gospel, but is happy being a Christian artist in the secular world .She said some in the industry were upset about the merchandising of the gospel. Who was she meaning? I hope she wasn’t meaning – Hillsong?
Although she writes worship songs that are for the building up of God’s people in the Church,… at the same time she recognises the importance of other songs as being like parables… taking the Church to people who would never walk into a church…
Sincere I’m sure, but deceived. Here we go again… saving the world through music. They are just going to hear our great tunes and lyrics, and come flocking to Jesus. Oh yeah that’s right….Jesus told parables too. But it was so the people wouldn’t understand – see Matt 13:10,11; Mark 4:10
So there you have it, Christians giving the world our version of their music. We have conned ourselves into believing a lie that we can serve and save the world through a relevant message and a guitar solo. But this is something even the world doesn’t believe, and all we have done is pollute the Church of God to its very core. This belief has lead to several Christians entering talent quests like Idol, all in the name of Jesus. These Christians run around in the name of Kingdom now, when all it is, is the going after earthly rewards, with little concern or impact for the kingdom of God.
We are promoting the church as the hope of the world, and not Christ. We have gone from a Contemporary Christianity to Cool Christianity, leading to a Christless Christianity; and the end result – a Counterfeit Christianity. Without doubt the great falling away is well underway!
To learn more go to:
Hillsong Jay Z and the Illuminati
Hillsong United Empires Upside Down Faith
Hillsong Music – Altered States of Consciousness
_______________________________________________________________
Footnotes:
1 – http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1005939,00.html
2 – http://thedoorclubs.com/home/
3 – http://russelldavidhobbs.com/cms/
4- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUH3wFBPlRg
5 – Key s to a deeper life – p22 A W Tozer
6- http://business.highbeam.com/410951/article-1G1-137759761/cellular-church
7- http://churchleadergazette.com/clg/2010/02/some-rules-for-selecting-music.html
8 — http://www.saddlebackfamily.com/story/7536.html
9 —http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillsong_Music_Australia#cite_note-0
Also — – http://www.christian-witness.org/aog/hillsong1.html
11 – Read more : http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/features/2010/january/25805-a-sound-from-down-under#ixzz1HU84t4zB
12– http://www.bewareofthegod.com/wp-images/not_like_us2.pdf
13 — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillsong_United_(band)
14 – http://www.aboutchristianmusic.com.au/mark_evans_feature.html
Also see http://www.lyricsfreak.com/h/hillsong+united/biography.html
15a http://www.johnthebaptisttv.com/?s=entertainment
16 – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aftermath
17 – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Lambert#cite_note-30
18 http://ancienthistory.about.com/cs/grecoromanmyth1/g/phoenixbird.htm
Also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_(mythology)
19 http://www.cephasministry.com/nwo_symbols.html
20 –http://ancienthistory.about.com/lr/symbols_of_rebirth/3379/3/
21 – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQzR5GpS7CE
Also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqSU37FcLdo&NR=1
22 – http://myhillsong.com/vision
23 – http://web.me.com/saddlebacksma/ssma/Instructors.html
24 – http://www.av1611.org/crock/crockex3.html
–http://www.timetracts.com/Tracts/knowthembytheirfruit.htm
further — http://www.av1611.org/question/cqsaved.html
25 – http://vimeo.com/16946072
26 – http://www.planetshakers.com/college/
27 -Get up — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCiGH8GJVd8&feature=related
Dance Now –http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rA_cyZpPbSc&NR=1
Boom – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkvZCLpHyDc&feature=related
29- http://blog.beliefnet.com/gospelsoundcheck/2009/10/christian-club-rocketown-plays.html
31- http://www.biblebelievers.com/watkins_tattoos/pagan.html
32 — http://www.aboutchristianmusic.com.au/brooke_fraser_interview.html
Tags:
Hillsong, Worship, Contemporary Christian Music, Joel Houston, Guy Sebastian, Brian Houston, Christianity, Adam Lambert, Aftermath, Brooke Fraser, Hillsong United, Stryper, Heavy Metal, Rick Warren, Jimi Hendrix, Saddleback Church, Tattoos, Apostasy
Coercion Code - "Dark Times are upon us" 
Fantastic article. Thank you.
I don`t know if this are all true, anyways. there are alot of False teachers now Like Apollo C Quiboly, He says he is Jesus Christ of this Generation.
“There is no longer any difference between the Church and the World, the devil has won!!! This type of ministry is appalling. Youth being lead by youth! These same young people come to church with alcohol on their breath from the night before”
First of all, the devil has NOT won. Its actually Christ Jesus who has won the victory.
What young people are coming to church with alcohol on their breath? Can you give names or examples? And where would you have them go if not to church where they just might hear the word of God and be saved? (Hopefully not your church where they would only hear about God’s wrath and be condemned)
Also, what is wrong with young people leading young people? Jesus Himself was only 33 when He gave His life for us on the cross. He was youth leading young and old alike.
You are standing in judgement against God’s children. Hillsong is full of spirit filled Christians who have devoted their lives to preaching the gospel through music to the world. Many young people already feel like outsiders and are afraid that they will not be considered “cool” if they worship God. But when they see other young people on stage singing praises to God they realize that they are not alone. It is NOT a “synagogue of satan.” Music can be a powerful tool, used by God to reach the lost just as it can be a powerful tool used by satan to deceive. You make it sound as if satan has more power to reach people through music than God does! When you talk about Hillsong you insult their music, the way they dress and even the way they praise God! Who are you to sit in judgment of anyone? Jesus Himself said, “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.” He also said, “Judge not lest ye be judged.” ONLY God knows what’s in their hearts and what their motives are. Are you saying that you believe it is wrong to be happy that Jesus Christ our Savior went to the cross in our place? That we should not clap and dance and celebrate? Are you also saying that our hearts should not be broken because our precious Savior endured so much horrible suffering and persecution all for us? (Aftermath) You condemn them no matter what they do.
As for the way they dress, they intentionally dress down (casual) because they do NOT want the focus on them. They want the focus to be on God.
” The room is black, the coloured lights flash all around” The room is not black..it is darkened so that people can feel comfortable worshiping God without feeling self conscious or looked at. Again, Hillsong wants the focus to be on God. The colored lights that flash around are there to celebrate the fact that our Savior lives! Again…who are you to sit in judgement of the way someone worships God?
“The pastor further explained that the first Hillsong LA gathering would be an opportunity for supporters “to meet/hang out/have fun” (that’s all they do anyway)”
Really? You can see into their hearts? You are with them 24/7? You know what they do in secret? You are making FALSE statements and judgements against God’s people. People you know nothing about. You are wrong and you need to be very careful what you say about someone who belongs to God or you just may find yourself hearing the words, “Depart from me” when you stand before God.
And what is wrong with having fun? I DO think its fun to worship God; I DO think its fun to bring glory to His name and I certainly enjoy being in His presence! Its fun! Would you rather the unsaved people think that in order to worship God and be a Christian you have to be boring and sad all the time? I so love my Father, God and I do reverence Him but I truly believe that He also wants us to be happy and have fun in Him. I know that He has a wonderful sense of humor and His love for me fills my heart with love for Him. Its wonderful fun for me to just get to talk to Him.
By the way…most spirit filled Christians, when referring to God, capitalize the “H” when writing or typing “Him” or “He” as a sign of respect. I noticed you never do that. So just fyi.
“Regardless of what style of worship, the music and lyrics have left God out of the picture.”
Really? Lets look at the album, Zion, by Hillsong in 2013..or as you call them…hellsong
Nothing Like Your Love…Hillsong
Love unchanging
God Your mercy never fades
And I’m surrounded
By Your compassion and Your grace
Chorus:
Your love
Brighter than the sun
More beautiful than words could ever say
This endless light
Shining over all
It leads me to Your glory everlasting
Was God left out of that one?
Oceans…where feet may fail…Hillsong
Your grace abounds in deepest waters
Your sovereign hand
Will be my guide
Where feet may fail and fear surrounds me
You’ve never failed and You won’t start now
So I will call upon Your name
And keep my eyes above the waves
When oceans rise
My soul will rest in Your embrace
For I am Yours and You are mine
I wonder whose name they’re talking about??
Mercy Mercy…Hillsong
Mercy mercy
Bring me to my knees
As the morning
Calls to light the dark in me
Heaven’s story
Breathing life into my bones
Spirit lift me
From this wasteland lead me home
Now I
Find my life in Yours
My eyes
On Your name
Arrest my heart
From its reckless path
Release the chains in me
Awake my soul
To the hope You hold
Your grace is all I need
Humble glory
Chose to carry all my shame
Rendered worthy
In the shadow of Your Name
Gracious fury
Written in my Savior’s scars
Mercy mercy
Now engraved upon my heart
Well Lance, there’s that name again
Who else could these lyrics be about? Jesus maybe? Or as you referred to Him, Jesus my girlfriend.
I am not saying that every person or group that claims to be a Christian is a Christian. But I am saying that I am not their judge and neither are you.
I know that when I’ve had some of Hillsong’s music playing in my home and I’m singing along and praising God, His presence fills my home and my heart. So I do not think God detests Hillsong or their music as you seem to. But Hillsong is not the only group or person you bash in your blogs. The whole thing looks like it was written by Fred Phelps of Westbore baptist church. You know…the guy who goes to people’s funerals carrying signs that say, “God hates fags.”
I am sorry to say that it is your blog that looks more like a “synagogue of satan.” Its totally judgmental and makes you look like a hypocrite rather than a Christian. Jesus taught love and mercy. He did not tell us to go out and search for what WE think is bad in a person or group and insult them, make fun of them and judge them. Your blog makes it seem like God is weak and the devil is in control when, in fact, just the opposite is true!
I am not writing this to bash or judge you. It is my sincere hope to help you see things from a loving perspective rather than an angry one.
I will be praying for you and I hope that you will allow God to open your eyes and your heart. As Christians, the Lord our God expects us to lead by example. If you were a non believer reading this blog, what would you think about the person who wrote it? What would you think about the things that were written about people?
We are called to be examples of God’s love and obey His word…not to judge and condemn others.
Best regards,
Robin Taylor
“There is no longer any difference between the Church and the World, the devil has won!!! This type of ministry is appalling. Youth being lead by youth!
First of all, the devil has NOT won. Its actually Christ Jesus who has won the victory.
Answer: Yes Robin, but look around “until He has put all His enemies under His feet”, the war goes on.
What is wrong with young people leading young people?
Answer:
God’s wise counsel says a leader shouldn’t be a young person.
1 Timothy 3:6
…Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
Jesus Himself was only 33 when He gave His life for us on the cross.
Answer: Yes… But He was the Son of God, not some pimple faced 20 something.
Luke 2:52
And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.
You are standing in judgement against God’s children.
Answer: No Robin, I’m standing in judgement of a Christian Organisation which is clearly run as a business.
Hillsong is full of spirit filled Christians who have devoted their lives to preaching the gospel through music to the world.
Maybe so…the article was to show that the music does not really contain the gospel, and it is clear from the leadership they rely on movies like ‘Noah’ to be the gospel seed.
Many young people already feel like outsiders and are afraid that they will not be considered “cool” if they worship God.
Answer: So are they fools for Christ, or are they ashamed of Christ (Rom 1:16 )
1 Corinthians 3:18-21
Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a FOOL, that he may be wise. 19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness. 20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain. 21 Therefore let no man glory in men….
Music can be a powerful tool, used by God to reach the lost just as it can be a powerful tool used by satan to deceive…..
Answer- So which is it?
You make it sound as if satan has more power to reach people through music than God does! When you talk about Hillsong you insult their music, the way they dress and even the way they praise God!
Answer: Yes the article was to show the clear downgrade in what we call ‘Christian Worship’, which clearly you see nothing wrong with.
Are you saying that you believe it is wrong to be happy that Jesus Christ our Savior went to the cross in our place?
Answer:
(Aftermath)
I showed aftermath has nothing to do with the cross of Christ!
As for the way they dress, they intentionally dress down (casual) because they do NOT want the focus on them. They want the focus to be on God.
Answer: Nooo…. They want to be COOL, just as you suggest.
” The room is black, the coloured lights flash all around” The room is not black..it is darkened so that people can feel comfortable worshiping God without feeling self conscious or looked at. Again, Hillsong wants the focus to be on God. The colored lights that flash around are there to celebrate the fact that our Savior lives!
Answer: Night Club, ….Night Club!!
1 Thessalonians 5:5
Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
And what is wrong with having fun? I DO think its fun to worship God;
Answer: Reverence and Fear go together, not reverence and fun (see Isaiah 6:1-3)
I’ll give a clue:
By the way…most spirit filled Christians, when referring to God, capitalize the “H” when writing or typing “Him” or “He” as a sign of respect. I noticed you never do that. So just fyi.
Answer:
Christ paid our price on the cross. He took our place. He took our penalty for sin, and received the very wrath of God poured out on him. He died a physical death, as the Eternal God! (taken from article)
“Regardless of what style of worship, the music and lyrics have left God out of the picture.”
Really?
Like Your Love…Hillsong
Love unchanging (etc.)
Chorus:
Your love
Brighter than the sun
More beautiful than words could ever say
This endless light
Shining over all
It leads me to Your glory everlasting
Was God left out of that one? Who else could these lyrics be about?
Answer: I wonder like most, because HE isn’t mentioned. Only concepts of Him are put to song.
These types of songs are just sentimental jibberish. You couldn’t sit down, and come up with direct verses of scripture from these cryptic crosswords.
Here’s a recemt song just to compare
HERE I AM TO WORSHIP LYRICS – CHRIS TOMLIN
Light of the world
You stepped down into darkness.
Opened my eyes, let me see.
Beauty that made this heart adore You
Hope of a life spent with You
Here I am to worship,
Here I am to bow down,
Here I am to say that You’re my God
You’re altogether lovely
Altogether worthy,
Altogether wonderful to me
King of all days
Oh, so highly exalted
Glorious in heaven above
Humbly You came
To the earth You created
All for love’s sake became poor
Here I am to worship,
Here I am to bow down,
Here I am to say that You’re my God
You’re altogether lovely
Altogether worthy,
Altogether wonderful to me
I’ll never know how much it cost
To see my sin upon that cross
I’ll never know how much it cost
To see my sin upon that cross
Etc..
I know in whom I have believed.
Jesus taught love and mercy.
Answer: He did, but what else? Grace to the humble, and Law to the proud.
Matthew 23:14-16
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows ‘houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. 15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves. 16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
We are called to be examples of God’s love and obey His word…not to judge and condemn others.
Answer:
1 John 4:1
Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try (test and judge) the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
Did you even look at the first two pics at the top of the article, or look at some of the video?
1 Tim 4:12- Let no one despise your youth, but be an example to the believers in word, in conduct, in love, in spirit, in faith and in purity.
God doesn’t despise youths. Why should you.
I wish Christians could spend time being Christian, and not judgemental.
John,
I assume you mean that being judgemental is not part of being a Christian?
Thank you for your comments! This kind of brother bashing is something God had to deliver me from. I might have really been in trouble after reading this blog if you and others hadn’t posted correct disagreeing posts. God ministers to me in such a real way and I feel his presence so strongly when I sing and listen to Hillsong, and it is a terrible thing to have such intimate communion stolen by a person who is judging others and not thinking about how he can actually hurt others’ walk with God with such terrible condemnation! Rick
Of course Rick, it must be brother bashing, and not anything else.
Have you even stopped to think for just a moment that your theology is based on feelings, and subjective experience?
Mmmm….”The Jews said to Jesus dont talk to us about being free, we are not in bondage to any man,…we have Abraham as our father” – John 8:31-34
They didn’t like correction either. They thought they were right.
I know this is only my opinion; but i hope it sheds some light. I was not brought up in any religion or faith and was born again in my twenties, when i was part of a very fundamentalist Christian group, Laymen’s Evangelical Fellowship (www.lef.org). I am very grateful that Mr. Joshua Daniel was used of God to reach me with the Gospel and that I was converted. However, since my family and all my associations during my youth and young adulthood had nothing Christian about them, i am still new to the ‘Pentecostal/Charismatic and ‘Tongues’ movements. Anyway, i put Hillsong in the same category as the ‘New Evangelism’ and, while i do believe they are reaching young people with the Gospel, i have real concerns about the depth of that work; and whether or not souls who are ‘reached’ through Hillsong are a) actually born again by the Spirit of God or just THINK or BELIEVE they are a Christian because of their new lifestyle, mental assent to the ‘Good News’ (whatever that means to them); and b) whether Hillsong, like many other supposedly solid ‘Christian’ businesses, are actually in it for the money and the love of money; and, worse, are actually being used directly and indirectly by Satan and his deceitful agents to deceive and ruin many souls. I say this partly because of the extremely lukewarm lyrics that Hillsong uses, and because in many songs they have crafted, there are elements of pagan ideas such as Sun worship, the rise of the Phoenix (‘You raised me from the ASHES’ for example); and there are worrying signs of occult symbols (either deliberately modified to hide them or else innocently used but which are, somehow, actually occult symbols. The Swastika, for example and the Pyramid, are occurring more and more frequently as part of modifed backdrops, props, images and etc. The reason i mention these things is because Satan is real and Satan is very anxious that the Christian church in particular learn to worship and serve him, even if it is by proxy or ‘by mistake.’ Many people don’t see the use of Baphomet in the worship or the messages; but that demon is being served and, in congregations of many thousands, you can be certain that some of Satan’s agents are definitely in the crowd (though you really cannot recognize them).
For some time, after i began evaluating my life in light of what Jesus says in the New Testament (and what the first disciples and the Apostles taught), i thought i was a Christian because i prayed, read the Bible, and sincerely wanted to repent for my sins. I did not know that it is impossible for a man or woman to become a Christian without the supernatural work of the Holy Spirit and His ‘conviction of sin’ that leads to true repentance. Later, after i was converted, i read the biography of John Wesley, who actually preached for 25 years without understanding that he was not converted, not saved; and not a Christian during all that time. So, in summary, i think this is a good article but it does not go nearly into enough detail. Perhaps the author was worried about being sued? In any case, a multimillion dollar business that SELLS the Word of God is, as far as i know, unscriptural from the outset: “Buy the Truth; and Sell it Not.” Proverbs 23:23 (KJV). If we have to ‘dress up’ the Gospel and Jesus Christ Himself in order to ‘be relevant,’ then we have lurched towards the precipice of irrelevance and complete destruction, for we will all become empty like Joel Osteen, who actually seems to think he is a Christian but does not know he is leading many to eternal damnation, just like Oprah Winfrey, Benny Hinn and many other deceivers.
From the comments, we can see how deceived we are. The Revelation says numerous times that if you have ears to listen to Holy Spirit, then listen. Yes, we cannot be judgemental to other brothers and sisters on their way of life and their personality. But we are to judge if there is a sound doctrine(after we repent and remove the log from our eyes). We are to test every sprit. Wake up, open up you ears. Open up you eyes.
Very true saying. This blog write up reminds me of the Pharisees and the Saducees. Always condeming. No one is perfect, so it not in our position to judge.
Thanks Robin, my whole heart felt so dark & heavy reading this blog, I couldn’t even read it all, I just skimmed through, but it was heavy. You’re response was exactly what I was feeling and I feel confident now in my conviction. It’s good to know I’m not the only one, God’s love is freeing, it doesn’t weigh us down but lifts us up. If we believe He is sovereign then we can rest easily knowing our concerns are taken care of, He has finished it! He has won! We needn’t worry. He’s taking care of it! Very well spoken response thanks for sharing!
-Drew
Well said, I totally agree. These bands are spreading God’s word and hope in a way very few churches are able to. There’s always going to be someone to slander good Christians who don’t follow the exact guidelines of their strict, and obviously sinless life by the sound of it.
the bands are spreading something, but when you look at the “bible”beliefs of the leaders of these music groups and look at the vague words of the music , it is a leap of faith to say that they are spreading God’s word. I think calling the leaders of Hillsong and Bethel “good Christians” is hard to prove when you compare their actions, songs and deeds with the teaching of scripture. what kind of “Jesus” are these Christians leading the youth too? the Jesus of the Holy bible??? Many of their songs do not make it clear who Jesus is or what he did.
What I think may be the case is that the leaders of Hillsong and Bethel want Jesus and the gospel of salvation to be different – they want them watered down.
whats wrong with the real Jesus and the real gospel as found in the Bible????.
Yes Carolyn,
Thanks for that…
As I wrote in my book Hellsong, it’s no longer a music ministry but a music industry
The music must appeal to a secular or quasi religious audience to enable record sales and concerts to be profitable
The lyrics are now accommodating a pop culture
hmmppf… can u also investigate the other christian songs or the christian singers like casting crown,, toby mac etc… because i’m curious whether they really are a worshiper of God or not… Thank you!! GOD BLESS!! 🙂
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Lance, you post a lot of scripture as if it will make what you’re saying correct. It will not. No matter how you try to justify it YOU are judging other Christians. Period. The bible says that you are NOT to judge others.
“Do not judge so that you will not be judged. “For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. “Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? “Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye? “You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye. (Matthew 7:1-5)
lance goodall
May 28, 2014 at 3:18 pm
John,
I assume you mean that being judgemental is not part of being a Christian?
No Lance, being judgemental is NOT part of being a Christian. Read Matthew 7:1-5. Or do you ignore that scripture because it does not fit with what you’re trying to say??
You sound an awful lot like the scribes and Pharisees in the bible that Jesus, Himself called hypocrites. You have put yourself in danger of being judged in the very same way that you have judged others.
You posted this scripture in your article trying to describe the people that YOU have decided are not Christians…but this scripture actually describes YOU.
2 Corinthians 11: 12 – 15
12And what I do I will continue to do, in order to undermine the claim of those who would like to claim that in their boasted mission they work on the same terms as we do. 13For such men are(Y) false apostles,deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. 14And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. 15So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds.
Here is another HILLsong song for you…
Hillsong – Love Song Lyrics
Artist: Hillsong
Closer than my thoughts
Closer than a kiss
How can it be more
Intimate than this?
More honest words than these I’ll never find
With all my heart, my strength, my soul, my mind
I love You, I love You, I’m Yours and You are mine
I love You, I love You, I love You Jesus Christ
Let me hear Your voice
Whisper Heaven’s song
Deeper into You
Is where I belong
More honest words than these I’ll never find
With all my heart, my strength, my soul, my mind
I love You, I love You, I’m Yours and You are mine
I love You, I love You, I love You Jesus Christ
Still cant figure out who they’re talking about? They have many songs that use the names of Jesus and God and they have many that do not. Many wonderful Christian music artists do not use the names of Jesus and God in ALL of their songs yet we all still seem to know who the songs are about.
The singers of Hillsong have been out there using all of their time to write and sing music to lead the lost to Christ and to glorify God. What do YOU do besides judge Christians?
What do YOU do to lead the lost to Christ? Your judgement of other Christians only confuses the nonbelievers.
What do YOU do to glorify God? Judging His children does NOT bring Him glory. It saddens and angers Him. Your snide remarks (unkind or insulting in an indirect way) about Christian musicians and young people are not pleasing to Him in any way.
You should choose your words very carefully when you talk about other Christians.
Here is the link to a sermon preached by Perry Stone that I hope you will watch and “try” to really listen to. But…if you have decided that Perry Stone is also promoting the devil then let me know and I will post the link to a sermon by the late David Wilkerson of Times Square Church who preached the same sermon.
I AM a God fearing, bible believing, Spirit filled Christian so I am not going to continue to argue back and forth with you. I do not believe its pleasing to God. This will be my last post. Chop it up and take sentences out of context if you like but do remember that you are NOT God, and you are NOT without sin. Therefore you are in NO position to judge ANYONE whether they are believers or not. Should you forget this, just refer back to Matthew 7:1-5.
Robin
Lance…sorry I forgot to answer your question of whether or not I looked at the first 2 pics or watched any of the video. Yes I did and in the first 2 pics I saw people raising their hands in worship and singing praises to God. In the video I saw the same thing. The venue where the video was made looked like many of the churches I’ve been in and seen on tv.
But if I had concerns about it I would contact them directly and voice those concerns. I would not publicly insult them by calling them “hellsong” and I would never judge them since only God knows what’s in their hearts.
Robin
Robin,
Regardless of the questions you have raised, I am quite serious about my critique of Hillsong Church, the organisation, NOT believers within the church. How can I do that? I am in no way suggesting that the majority are not saved. But rather question the kind of gospel being preached, and level of ‘spiritual’ song pumped out on any given Sunday and require to know how it can be considered God honouring?
If I am not to judge, then do I make no comment about Mormons, JWs, Islam, Seven Day Adventists, Roman Catholic beliefs either? Is judge not some blanket rule perhaps?
I think its obvious I am going for the ball (doctrine, beliefs) and not the player (believers)
What I have stated clearly in one article is, it is my firm opinion that Hillsong have played the harlot long enough….. God will give INDIVIDUALS within the cult time to come out, but as an organisation, its leadership are clearly deluded and under God’s judgement. There is no turning back. They have suppressed and withheld the truth in unrighteousness for years now, and now they worship the same gods as the world. They will not be able to recognise the coming Anti- Christ because they are helping to prepare the way for the Man of Sin!!
They are making the way straight for the FALSE CHRIST!
Therefore God has given them over to this deception of loving the world, all in the name of Christ!
I have decided to post 3 articles on this topic of Judging, and you can ‘judge’ for yourselves….
See https://coercioncode.com/2014/01/04/hillsong-jay-z-the-illuminati-and-the-coming-anti-christ/
Hi Robin,
You make good points. As far as i can remember, Jesus also said this: “….but and if ye do judge, judge justly.” Can you explain this? In other words, Jesus clearly teaches those who trust Him to ‘make a decision about’ whether someone is appropriately representing Him or not; or are they mistaken in what they are saying or doing, or teaching, if they are saying that they are a Christian; or that ‘Jesus taught this.’ Honestly, i have to agree with Lance and disagree thoroughly with you Robin, because i believe what Jesus and Lance are talking about is DISCERNMENT. Lance is not ‘condemning’ Hillsong or anyone in it PER SE but using his God-given discernment to teach us (believers and unbelievers alike) that Hillsong does have some issues that need attention. Is that really so evil? Especially, if those issues might actually result in people ultimately rejecting and hating Jesus, once they find out that He is not what Hillsong ‘sold’ them. Anyway, the following article on ‘Should Christians Judge?’ says a lot of helpful things on this topic, much better than i can: please would you read it (it isn’t very long): http://www.biblebelievers.com/jmelton/Judging.html
“The message is still the same but the methods of bringing this message forth have changed”
Good point you are making… we should not compromise.
I am myself involved in our church’s Youth Ministry for the past 8 years. What was relevant 8 years ago for the youth we worked with does no work with the group we have today. We have had to change our methods but the message has remained the same… which I believe is the case with Hillsong.
The writer is so quick to criticize the methods that are being used… we are all about building God’s Kingdom, Reaching out to the lost…. How is this article helping with the mission that God has given us.
Oh great wise one, writer of this article, please enlighten us with great wisdom on how to reach out to this lost and dying generation. If you can write this article criticising the methods being used to reach out to this generation, I am sure you can also write an article about how to effectively reach out to this generation in a way that revival will sweet throughout the world… Give us ways that have been tried and tested and are working effectively.
I am open and teachable to new ideas and insights. And I believe that Hillsong and all other ministries out there labouring among the youth of today are also open for suggestions…
What is God saying to you about this article…? Is this article honouring God?
How are you as a “follower of Christ, if you really are one” building God’s kingdom through this article?
Yeah… so we will be waiting for the follow up article on how to reach out to this generation…
Thank you Gregory. Well said. May God bless you for the work you do with your church’s youth.
Why should the method of delivery be changed? this is a denial of the Power in GODs WORD to SAVE! We are the sheep of our SUPREME LORD JESUS CHRIST, we hear HIS voice and we follow him. We don’t follow men and music. We do not have the authority to change anything from the way GOD ordained his message to be delivered.
To reach out to the children of the Kingdom, we deliver the Message as Our LORD GOD intended, not us. The power is not in the delivery, it is in HIS WORD! And all those that hear his Voice, are children of HIS Kingdom.
GOD is not mocked, he knows who his children are and NONE shall be left behind, because we were chosen by HIM. The rest will continue to walk in darkness because the truth was never in them from the start. Therefore, how can we justify our actions because that is the way the modern world is?
We are not from this world. Do you realise that every day we breathe in our bodies we are not Living, we are actually Dying! Each day we grow older and closer to our Graves. But the Life we are given through Jesus Christ our supreme Lord is Eternal.Regenerating, each day makes us younger, not older. When Jesus said; Unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you have no part with me, he was talking about HIS WORD!
The Word was with GOD and the WORD became Flesh! GOD has already given us the Key to eternal Life, and it is in HIS WORD! Not in MUSIC, or false preachers and false Doctrines (baal prophets)
JESUS our Supreme Lord said himself; My kingdom is not of this world. Therefore, this world is not for us (children of the kingdom). Love not the World or anything in the world. He who loves his Mother and father more than me is not worthy of Me. Seek first the Kingdom of GOD and HIS righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you. We cannot LOVE GOD if we Don’t know him. And those that Know GOD fear him, for fear of GOD is the beginning of Wisdom. IT is Dreadful to end up in the Hands of the LORD! FEAR and REVERENCE! Our Supreme Lord Jesus Christ did not preach a feel Good Gospel, He spoke the truth and many turned away.
Anyone who knows GOD and HIS WORD knows that HIS WORD, the LAW, and the PROPHETS are the Authority of GOD’s kingdom. We also know that GOD’s Kingdom has always had a structure and Order that our Fathers followed. IT was by following this Structure, that our fathers had access to GOD (worship) and His Secrets of the Kingdom. Therefore, the Word (Jesus) the Law (Moses) and The Prophet (Elijah) are the Gospel.
We cannot trade one for the other, or ignore one and follow the other because without both the Law and the Prophet we don’t have the WORD of GOD. Thus, by Authority of GOD he has always provided a PROPHET to deliver HIS WORD to his Children. GOD does not change. Even KING DAVID did not preach through Psalms, it was his Private Worship.
So, according to the Bible, Malachi 4; 4-6, Matt 17;11, John 16;13, we are to receive one last PROPHET to guide us, to Prepare us for the second Coming of our LORD, lest he smite the Earth with a curse. He will turn the hearts of the fathers to their children, and the children’s hearts to their fathers. This is ELIJAH, the Great Prophet of Tishbite that must return to restore all things.
GOD who knows the end from the Beginning, knows that his Bride (the Church) will be in shambles in the last days, So he said he would send us HIS servant Elijah to restore all things, to teach us his ways, the True Gospel-LOGOS, the plan for salvation.
So sorry to say this to all the Feel Good Christians, But according to the Word of GOD, our wonderful creator, possessor of Heaven and Earth, we cannot be saved until Elijah returns to teach us GOD’s Salvation, Because many tare gospels were grown with the wheats and many children of the Kingdom have been led astray.
Just look at all the previous Angels of the church Ages. Each one of our fathers had a message to preach. Enoch (transfiguration) Noah (baptism) Abraham (circumcision) Moses (Law) Joshua (revelation) Jesus Christ our Supreme Lord (remission of Sins and Eternal Life) Who trusted HIS GOSPEL (the Church) to Peter, NOT PAUL! Peter was the 6th Angel of the 6th Church Age, Peter (the WORD), James (the LAW) and John (the PROPHET). In each church age we, the children of the kingdom, were given an angel to deliver the WORD of GOD. Don’t be deceived, GOD does not change.
This means, Every church, [Demon]ination (denomination), Every Gospel preached until Elijah’s Return is not teaching the True GOSPEL and is a deception. Seek the word yourself, read your bible, seek GOD in Prayer and intimate worship privately, not as the heathens do in public so everyone can see. Ask Our Great and wonderful GOD to reveal his truth. Don’t rely on Tare preachers and Tare Gospels.
GOD will deliver his children as he did in Egypt (world) and lead his Nation (children of the Kingdom) to Canaan (heaven). But just as Moses was unable to make the Journey beyond the wilderness (LAW) it is only By Joshua (Jesus) Salvation, that can bring down the walls of Mortality through Revelation! Just as Joshua received instructions on how to bring down the walls of Jericho, The 7th angel of the 7th Church – the Great Prophet Elijah from the Highest Order will also guide us by revelation to Eternal Life. IT is the revelation from GODS WORD that will teach us to put on our immortality.
SO MUSIC CANNOT DO THIS, MODERN ADJUSTMENTS CANNOT ACHIEVE THIS! ONLY GODS WORD!
Seek GOD and his WORD which will be delivered by the 3rd Elijah, for the Spirit of Elijah will guide us into the Ark to save us from the GLORY and WRATH of OUR LORD GOD in that Great and Dreadful day of The LORD.
The Spirit of Elijah has returned, we are in the Last days. He has the Ark for our safety. These revelations are pouring from his mouth. (NOT ME)
All true seekers of GOD, Check out
Ark of Jesus ministry international.
Disciple of Christ
Thanks for the great thoughts and insight.
John 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned..
Romans 14:4 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.?????? Answer to this?
Why do you say all of this?
Are we not ment to uplift eachother?
Did not David the Crazy dancer have a heart after God Himself?
Your verse quoted from Rom 14 is in reference to food? Someone who ate something, being judged by another? This is hardly the same as rock music which is a tool of the devil.
Here a few verses which actually pertain to the article:
For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God -Rom 8:5-8
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. Rom 12:2
Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good – Rom 12:9
But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof. – Rom 13:14
I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple – Rom 16:17
Part of challenge of responding to an article like this is that you cover so many topics that it makes folks not want to respond comprehensively due to having to address so many points. I’ll try to do so succinctly using your topics.
The Christian Nightclub
This is an interesting topic. You basically ask a question “Is it biblical to worship in a night club setting?” Though I don’t personally enjoy these types of concert events, I have led and attended a night of praise and worship. These events you disparage are basically a night of praise and worship in a concert-like setting. I don’t agree with how all these events are handled, but there isn’t anything wrong with singing and dancing at a praise night. It isn’t sin. You may not enjoy this type of event and it may not be for everyone, and calling it a “Club” would personally bother me, but it seems to me that the heart behind the event is good. Engage people in a non-traditional way for the sake of sharing the gospel.
The devil has not won. The war is over. The battle may rage, but Christ has already won. What exactly is a sin in dressing up for Halloween? Or drinking alcohol in moderation? or being young? There is a big difference between youth and being a novice. You issues you have are more of tradition than sin/purity.
Rick Warren
I don’t agree with everything Rick does, or singing a Hendrix song during worship, but rock/rap/country/metal are all acceptable forms of music in even a worship setting. Once again, you are talking more from a traditional background. Christian music is the only genre that is defined by lyrical content, and not music style. There is no “sacred” musical style. One can even use “secular” music in a worship context to make a point, even if it is created by a sinner like Hendrix. In fact, isn’t all music of the world written by sinners… It is disingenuous to say Hendrix believed in this, so Rick Warren believes the same. That is basically the argument you made.
The Celebrity Driven Church.
For some, this has definitely become an issue. Honestly, our church uses many songs from Hillsong, Tomlin, Crowder, etc. songs but mainly for the quality of the songs vs. who released them. All of these ministries/people have great songs and some terrible songs.
The whole Worship Music business is definitely driven by profit, but that is by definition. I’d like to think that there are decisions that are different due to hopefully Christians that are running these companies, but its all speculation, which you do quite a bit in this entire section.
Lyrical Content (you basically bash a bunch of songs)
I guess you don’t like metaphors in Christian songs. That’s OK. I don’t love it either. I don’t like “rose trampled on the ground” (this is a simile) or uses of phoenix “imagery”. Personally, I hate the song “Break Free” and would never sing it in a worship context or sing it at all. I think whoever wrote it had the right heart intention and message they wanted to send. Not great execution, but I wouldn’t call it repugnant.
Aftermath, elevate not being in the bible. No English words are in the bible, so stop being silly. Elevate means “to be lifted up” and that idea is definitely presented in the bible. Aftermath means “what period that follows after a catastrophe”. I believe Hillsong is saying, the cross was seemingly a catastrophe. The King of Jews, Son of God died the most horrific death, and to the people at that time, it was a catastrophe. The plan of God, seemingly ruined. But the catastrophe or ruin was part of the glorious plan that God has for His people. The catastrophe/ruin was in fact a necessary and vital part of His plan. It’s metaphorical. It’s clever I think. Just because other bands use the word “Aftermath” in a straightforward way doesn’t mean anything.
The rest of your article, you continue bash specific actions of a performance venue/cafe, tattoos (we’re allowed to eat pork now aren’t we?), musical styles (metal specifically), and criticizing someone for writing songs that are not explicitly in worship of God.
Music is a vehicle, a tool, that folks can use either to glorify God or not. If you decide to write songs about romantic love, there is nothing wrong with that. If you have a problem with it, don’t listen to it, but it isn’t sin.
To use broad strokes to attack everything a particularly ministry like Hillsongs or Saddleback, is not only judgemental, but I would go as far to say that it is divisive, and maybe even say it is something a modern Pharisee would say, and the heart behind it is not motivated by love or grace, and therefore is sin.
There is definitely some negative things associated with the modern Christian music movement, and it can definitely be done incorrectly and wrong, but there is much that is positive coming out of these ministries you speak negatively of. It might be contemporary, and even cool, but is it really Christless? I don’t think so.
God bless you.
I agree with your reply. Saying “the devil has won” goes against the bible. The war was won at the cross. That argument stops there, with the blood of Christ.
Simply put, many Christian bands perform in what you could call a “rock concert” setting. Does that also mean “the devil has won” because Christian bands are “bringing the rock concert into the church”? No. A “night club” is defined by what they peddle. Same for “bar”, or any other analogous name you prefer to insert. The intention of traditional night club patrons is NOT to lift the name of Jesus. If there is no alcohol, et. al. commonly found in the description of a night club, then it’s not a night club. Should it be a big “show” type environment? Maybe, maybe not. But, I don’t see any scripture that says “though shalt not have light shows”. Basically what is happening here is the big contemporary touring shows, also touting big screens, lights, and pyrotechnics, is reproduced in a non-portable format.
The question comes down to the Spirit. Are folks there gathering in the name of Chris and lifting up his name? Is there any blasphemy occurring? If the “sins” often associated with “night club” have been removed, it’s not longer a “night club”. Just because it resembles something in the world doesn’t mean it is OF the world. Otherwise, “Spiritfest” and other similar concerts are in grave trouble. If this so called “night club” has replaced the things of death with the things of life, it’s going to be much easier to reach those that are familiar with this setting.
Believers of Christ, his true elect, are no long under the old law (legalism). It’s not what goes in a man’s mouth that defiles him, but rather what comes out. Hence, if the patrons are gathering in the name of Chris, who are we to judge? And to add…who exactly did Jesus hang with? Thieves. Liars. Those in need of a physician. The very people who are “comfortable” in the club-like setting.
I think this type of venue would draw non-Christians more readily than walking into a Church. It could very well be the catalyst to introducing someone to God that would have never otherwise darkened the door of a church. If the outcome is the saving of souls and lifting Christ, that can not be a bad thing.
Hi Kent,
It is important that we have ‘biblical’ thinking on such matters.
I will focus on your one argument which is;
“Just because it resembles something in the world doesn’t mean it is OF the world. Otherwise, “Spiritfest” and other similar concerts are in grave trouble. If this so called “night club” has replaced the things of death with the things of life, it’s going to be much easier to reach those that are familiar with this setting.” (Quote)
In the United States a business man has decide to spend millions on a collabaration between traditional style churches and the Macdonalds franchise. The idea is to Turn certain dying churches whose numbers are dwindling into a family atmosphere with the help of the burger chain.
This may seem a great idea to some, or quite absurd to others. So what is this guy trying to do? He is trying to keep the church alive, as a place that still has a presence in society. But where is the gospel? They can come to church to eat a big Mac or just go down the road to a local outlet as they normally would.
In the same way people may come to church to hear great music and to enjoy a great time, but again where is the gospel. The Lord’s command was not ‘go and produce high quality bands and rock concerts and the world will be impressed and come to you to be saved”
No… Go into all the world and preach the gospel, making disciple, teaching them Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you
Kent to assume that because something is not directly referenced in the scripture then it must be ok, is such poor logic. Some things the bible doesnt directly talk about like is it ok to use electricity, than it does to use the aid of rock bands.
If you look at Jesus ministry many followed him for the benefits – see John 6
In other words when things were easy Jesus had lots of followers, but when things were asked of them,then they walked away.
The question must be is the method we are using wisdom from above, or is it is earthly, sensual, devilish?
Do you not know that friendship (any alliance) with the world is emnity against God? – James 4:4
I conclude by suggesting that many that converted through this type of ministry are not truly saved and are false converts. Why?
1 John 4:5
They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.
http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/rockbook/CH_05_ROCK_RHYTHM.html
I am still doing much research and it was definitely hard to believe at first, but this article^ has too much science to deny.. Unfortunately, no rock music is not a good form of worship music and cannot be used for such, no matter what the lyrics are. Yes there are forms of holy music. Classical music, with exact mathematical consistencies and properties and that is congruent with human heartbeats and physiology and the way of nature, is the scared music, in my opinion. And the opinion of hundreds of music scholars who know far more than I.
Lance,
As I was reading this article, I was so happy to see an actual God fearing Christian who wasn’t confirmed to this world and the things of this world. God tells us to trust in Him with all our heart and lean not on our own understanding. Praise God that you were able to use scripture to get your message across. It’s not so much that you are bashing the church, it’s that you can see the influences of witchcraft and evil forces at work in the New Age Christian churches (especially through their music). Praise God, because He warns us of such things in His Word. We should put to death our former man! I would greatly like if you and I can speak more. Just to fellowship. It’s very rare to find a person such as yourself in this perverse and evil world. My email is jgutie28@gmail.com.
Thanks 🙂
Hi Julie,
What is so very sad is to see the majority of Christians posting against Lance and saying he is being ‘judgmental.’ Is it judgmental of me to state that i am concerned my dear brother or sister in the Lord may not actually be born again? That, because he or she loves Hillsong and similar music and, if prompted, would agree that a big part of their attachment is due to the COOLNESS of the band, the concerts, and the ROCK MUSIC they blast with 1000 watt speakers? Should i not be concerned, if my brother in the flesh attended a Hillsong ‘Live Event’ and says he is now a Christian, and is converted; but there is ABSOLUTELY no evidence of this in his life, for the past five years? There really seems to be a horrible reality in the world: souls that are still lost and dead to Christ, but who believe they know Him. Without being born again; and without knowing Jesus Christ, these souls are still lost and, much worse, believe sincerely that they are born again (perhaps especially because they ‘speak in tongues.’ Yet Jesus never spoke in tongues, nor did any of His disciples; and it appears the actual meaning of ‘new tongues’ in the original texts is: ‘a known language of the period; but unknown to the speaker, and miraculously delivered to him or her through the Holy Spirit, in order to serve as a witness of Christ in the believer speaking; and to those hearing.” From my own experience (i give a brief testimony above) the lyrics used by Hillsong and the music style definitely has a ‘feel’ to it which is not of God, partly because there seems to be a real focus on another Jesus, who is being worshipped through music like Hillsong’s and other similar groups, which spirit is of Belial or Baal. For example, the use of Hallelu JAH and ‘Jehovah’ in the lyrics. If you have interest and time, do a Google search on the actual meaning of JAH and Jehovah and tell me, is that Jesus you are praising when you use those words? Is it the LORD that is the Father of all Whom Jesus refers to when He prays ‘Our Father.”? From what i understand they are not the same person….which is truly troubling…
Hi Sam,
Thanks for taking the time out to state these things. I doubt you’ll here from Robin.
“One question for you. Wasnt quite sure about what you were meaning here;
For example, the use of Hallelu JAH and ‘Jehovah’ in the lyrics. If you have interest and time, do a Google search on the actual meaning of JAH and Jehovah and tell me, is that Jesus you are praising when you use those words? Is it the LORD that is the Father of all Whom Jesus refers to when He prays ‘Our Father.”? From what i understand they are not the same person….which is truly troubling…”
Yah: the name of the God of Israel
Original Word: יָהּ
Part of Speech: Proper Name
Transliteration: Yah
Phonetic Spelling: (yaw)
Short Definition: LORD
God-fearing has become rare, I agree.
Im sorry but I feel that this article is completely wrong in its portrayal of the music group Hillsong. Yes, I agree it is greatly important to show that as Christians we are set apart from the world and do not conform to the ways of it but Hillsong is not doing so. The band is not perfect and in some ways has failed but I think it is wrong to portray them as stumbling stones of christians. You compare their song to old hymns and explain how you feel they are not direct or in some cases contain new age ideas. You may not understand this new way of worship because it may seem different to the music you are familiar but in the end Hillsong only lifts God up in honest praise. I believe this article is mostly speaking blasphemy and judgement that comes from a place of malice. For you to call this band Hellsong is completely wrong. As christians we are supposed to judge our fellow christians if we see that they are not following the truths that God has given us but when we do so it should come from a place of love. I encourage you to watch interviews and the new Hillsong movie coming out soon. You will see how humble and God-searching that these people are. They are immensely inspired by the Holy Spirit and it is dangerous to call something evil that is good.
Andrew,
Thank you for your comments.
I dont want to write another article here.
This verse came to me today which I believe is God’s word regarding Hillsong.
” To obey is better than sacrifice” – 1 Sam 15:22
In other words, don’t give the type of service, worship, your efforts, or what you think is suitable, what you think is odedience and expect God to accept it on YOUR terms. God sets the rules for obedience, and we need to do their upmost to comply. Much of what Hillsong does is worldly success, fame and fortune.
I leave you with these few quotes from more learned men than me……
i. “Partial obedience is complete disobedience.
Saul and his men obeyed as far as suited them; that is to say, they did not obey God at all, but their own inclinations, both in sparing the good and destroying the worthless. What was not worth carrying off was destroyed, – not because of the command, but to save trouble.” (Maclaren)
ii”We are prepared to obey the Divine commands up to a certain point, and there we stay. Just as soon as ‘the best and choicest’ begin to be touched, we draw the line and refuse further compliance. We listen to soft voices that bid us to stay our hand, when our Isaac is on the altar.” (Meyer)
iii. “But an even deeper reading of this story is permissible. Throughout the Bible Amalek stands for the flesh, having sprung from the stock of Esau, who, for a morsel of meat, steaming fragrantly in the air, sold his birthright. To spare the best of Amalek is surely equivalent to sparing some root of evil, some plausible indulgence, some favourite sin. For us, Agag must stand for that evil propensity, which exists in all of us, for self-gratification; and to spare Agag is to be merciful to ourselves, to exonerate and palliate our failures, and to condone our besetting sin.” (Meyer)
Utter pile of nonsense. JESUS knew no sin and became sin for us so that we would be free from the bondage of sin and death. And that is exactly how hillsomg is doing it. Trying to bring the gospel to the world in those terms so that the world understands better. U cannot talk to a person on spiritual terms cos hel think u r a fool. U have wasted time writing this without even thinking. False accusations on a spirit filled church. U have no authority to judge anybody. Before quoting scripture to support ur accusations, use scripture to guide u spiritually.
Keziah,
Not sure you read the article, nor took time to click on the youtube clips or look at the photos.
Even if I didnt use scripture to back up my argument, I have shown specific and clear examples of how the use of music, instead of TRUTH is where Hillsong have erred.
JESUS knew no sin and became sin for us so that we would be free from the bondage of sin and death, is only half the story. The other is repent, and be baptised for the removal of your sins.
Applying scripture must always be applied to our lives both as individuals and as a church body, which I do, and have done here.
And he said, Go, and tell this people,
Hear ye indeed, but understand not;
and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
Make the heart of this people fat,
and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes;
lest they see with their eyes,
and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed. – Is 6:9,10
Mr Lance. What steps have you taken besides sitting behind a screen and bashing christian, to lead people to Jesus Christ. How is your life giving glory to God. How many people through your lifestyle have you lead to Christ. How are you a good influence to the youths of today. How do you intend to remain relevant in the kind of world we live in today. You can lead thousand to Jesus until you’re relevant to them.
Many christian hid behind not wanting to be worldly instead of going into the world as Jesus say and make disciples. Jesus asked us to go into the World.
Instead christian are comfortable with just hanging around Christians like us and not shining our light to the lost generation. It is sinners that need saving and that should be your preoccupation. Not whether Hillsong glorifies God or not. Let God be the judge of that. Don’t do his work for him because by doing that you are taking His glory from Him.
You’re bashing people who devote their life, money, time to reach out to the lost and yes that should make profit, because even the gospel requires money. Don’t you make profit. Without money will you be able to reach out with this article.
I’m sure if you were in bible times, you will bash Jesus for hanging out with sinners. You will bash Mary Magdalena for washing the feet of Jesus with perfume. You will bash Prophet Josiah a for marrying an harlot even though God told him to do so. You will judge King David for dancing naked.
We are not perfect beings, if we were we would not need the grace of God.
I’m I’ve being greatly imparted by the ministry of Hill song, I don’t agree with all their ways but I believe that God is pleases with them.
Try preaching Jesus to a drunkard and an addict with your rigid doctrine and hymns and let us know the outcome.
Best regards.
Taiwo,
You probably could be right on some points.
But let me ask what is Hillsong really achieving? What are they building?
1 Cor 3:
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for up to now ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. For ye are still carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase. Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
A W Tozer wrote;
ALL UNANNOUNCED AND MOSTLY UNDETECTED there has come in modern times a new cross into popular evangelical circles. It is like the old cross, but different: the likenesses are superficial; the differences, fundamental.
From this new cross has sprung a new philosophy of the Christian life, and from that new philosophy has come a new evangelical technique-a new type of meeting and a new kind of preaching. This new evangelism employs the same language as the old, but its content is not the same and its emphasis not as before.
The old cross would have no truck with the world. For Adam’s proud flesh it meant the end of the journey. It carried into effect the sentence imposed by the law of Sinai. The new cross is not opposed to the human race; rather, it is a friendly pal and, if understood aright, it is the source of oceans of good clean fun and innocent enjoyment. It lets Adam live without interference. His life motivation is unchanged; he still lives for his own pleasure, only now he takes delight in singing choruses and watching religious movies instead of singing bawdy songs and drinking hard liquor. The accent is still on enjoyment, though the fun is now on a higher plane morally if not intellectually.
The new cross encourages a new and entirely different evangelistic approach. The evangelist does not demand abnegation of the old life before a new life can be received. He preaches not contrasts but similarities. He seeks to key into public interest by showing that Christianity makes no unpleasant demands; rather, it offers the same thing the world does, only on a higher level. Whatever the sin-mad world happens to be clamoring after at the moment is cleverly shown to be the very thing the gospel offers, only the religious product is better.
The new cross does not slay the sinner, it redirects him. It gears him into a cleaner and jollier way of living and saves his self-respect. To the self-assertive it says, “Come and assert yourself for Christ.” To the egotist it says, “Come and do your boasting in the Lord.” To the thrill seeker it says, “Come and enjoy the thrill of Christian fellowship.” The Christian message is slanted in the direction of the current vogue in order to make it acceptable to the public.
The philosophy back of this kind of thing may be sincere but its sincerity does not save it from being false. It is false because it is blind. It misses completely the whole meaning of the cross.
Wow! I told a local pastor who invited me to hear a concert at a church that I don’t walk in the door of the 501c3 synagogues of satan. They made the devil the head of their churches… and God told me not to set foot in the door of those dens of iniquity. The real Christians… who can hear God… are like Elvis after a concert. (pun intended). We’ve left the building.
Lance,
Thank you for being strong despite receiving negative comments. You have presented your thoughts very well. As a worship leader for many years, I am very well versed in all the latest Christian songs being churned out by these artists. I too have noticed a degradation in the lyrics where as a Christian, I understand the theme or message of the song, but in reality there is no true theological substance to the lyrics.. Ie (God’s great dance floor by a favourite artist of mine Chris Tomlin). It is a sad reality that the church is catering to this world. I too am not condemning the individual but I do wonder what these big mega churches are doing to save the lost. Christians must be very vigilant and be on the attack against Satan and his lies. He unfortunately is the ruler of this world, but I have no fear because Jesus has already won the fight.
Be blessed.
Thank you for your article. I’ve read many like yours, and appreciate the time you have put into writing. Learning more and more, that, yes, there is definitely a falling away of sorts within the church. And darkness has infiltrated our churches. The problem I’m running into is. ..what’s the alternative? Many are saying this and that is bad, stay away, but they aren’t giving an alternative to…now what? If playing those songs in church isn’t a good thing, then what songs are? Whose music writing is untainted? Would love to see that question answered!
Hi DP
Thanks for your comments and questions.
If you don’t mind here is a reply I gave to Sammy a few months back.
I was previously in a church that was very influenced and shaped by the culture and music of Hillsong. In fact it was a mini Hillsong. Anyway what I am trying to say is Hillsong music is now off the menu, and does nothing for me spiritually now, except for some of the old ones. It’s like eating a TV dinner, and having a good home cooked meal. It doesn’t compare.
On the whole Hillsong is manufactured, trite, common, and fails to meet the following criteria;
1) — Foremost does it contain biblical doctrine
2 ) — Does it teach us about who God is
3 ) — Does it perhaps shows us the condition of man in the light of who God is
4 ) — Does the song give the gospel, talk of salvation themes like sin, corruption, man’s blindness, the cross, the blood , the resurrection, hope of eternal life
5 ) — Does the melody distract or induce worship
6) — Does the music/musicians play for entertainment, themselves, or for God’s glory
7) – Does the whole thing ring true or is it just making noise.
8) — Is the beat dominating and creating a barrier to worship in the proper sense.
Well having said that please take some time to listen to 2 versions of the same song – All Creatures of Our God and King- Traditional Hymn
David crowder band
Fernando Ortega
And finally this newish song Hillsong (feat. Laura Toganivalu) – You Crown The Year – YouTube
I would like you to give me your comments rather than my offering my conclusions, then I’m here convincing you rather you learning and coming to your own understanding.
In conclusion:
I think we need to be prepared to go back to some of the hymns.
Amazing Grace
The king of love my shepherd is
Jesus lover of my soul
Fairest Lord Jesus
Great is thy faithfulness
To name a few.
I look forward to hearing back from you
God Bless
Lance
Hi Lance,
I was actually browsing on how to get the ‘Word’, bible from Hillsong and google answer me about the controversy of Hillsong, so I continue to browse and fall for your article. To be honest, it is a super long for me to read, but I finished anyway. I appreciate your effort to write this whole thing which I could say that ‘this is the answer for me’. I love some songs of Hillsong and Planetshakers -seriously, but when I attend their church I was somehow feeling lost. When they praise, I feel like the euphoria of the young generations (some of them -maybe), is not go for the grace and kindness of Christ but because they feel the beat of the musics.
So, what gospel musics do you listening to? And church you attends?
Above all I will stick with 1 Thessalonians 5:21
Thank you
Dear Felicia,
Thank you for your note today. It’s always nice to hear from those who have been helped. Praise the Lord that he leads those who are willing sheep. I have a number of articles on my blog about ‘Hillsong’ if you wanted to search some more when you are not so tired…:) Sorry the article is so long….
There are many old songs that Hillsong did that are still meaningful some time back
Hosanna
My greatest love is you
None but Jesus
Carry me
So maybe go back to the ninties and early 2000’s
There was a definite change in the 2003/4 if I remember?
Anyway the need is for ALL of us who say we walk with the Lord to have our own guidance to understand the difference between the truth and lies, good and evil.
I think its important to head back to some of the old hymns
Amazing Grace – Chris Tomlin is the modern version
And can it be –
When I survey the wonfrous cross
Great is thy faithfulness
O for a thousand tongues to sing
The Getty’s have some great modern hymns. They are a couple who work in co-operation with Stuart Townsend.
Sovereign grace are also helpful.
You may also find it useful to read my comments below to DP.
I attend a small christian fellowship in Australia.
God bless
Lance
From an article I came across a year or two ago:
http://blog.ncbaptist.org/renewingworship/2011/02/09/worship-wars/
An excerpt:
Worship Wars
(This is the first article of a 10-part series)
Take a look at this excerpt from an U.S newspaper objecting to the new trends in church music:
There are several reasons for opposing it.
One, it’s too new.
Two, it’s often worldly, even blasphemous.
The new Christian music is not as pleasant as the more established style.
Because there are so many songs, you can’t learn them all.
It puts too much emphasis on instrumental music rather than Godly lyrics.
This new music creates disturbances making people act indecently and disorderly.
The preceding generation got along without it.
It’s a money making scene and some of these new music upstarts are lewd and loose.
Does this sound like some of the “fan” mail you receive the week after you have pushed the envelope in worship with some new worship songs?
This was written by a pastor in 1723 attacking Isaac Watts, the writer of great hymns like When I Survey the Wondrous Cross, Joy to the World, and O God, Our Help in Ages Past.
You see, “worship wars” are nothing new to our decade. As long as we have had organized church and people with personal preferences, there has been conflict. As James 4:1 says,
What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don’t they come from your desires that battle with you?
You see, worship wars have been raging at least since around 700 a.d. Here are some highlights outlined by Steve Hamrick of the Illinois Baptist State Convention:
When the Gregorian Chant became the official music of the church, it was characterized by a single monophonic unaccompanied melody sung only by men. Later young boys with unchanged voices started singing with the men but their voices were displaced by an octave. There were many who objected. Later harmony was added to the music of the church but many were against it.
When Luther started writing hymns for the church in 1517 there was a great revolt.
In 1540 Calvin stated that only the Old Testament Psalms sung in a metrical rhythm were appropriate for worship (The Genevan Psalter). This caused great division among the church between Calvin’s followers and Luther’s.
Near 1750 the Wesley brothers wrote hymns that taught theology and doctrine. It again caused great struggle among church leaders.
The music of the 1880’s Sunday School Era was looked down on by many because the hymns and testimony songs being written were subjective (personal) and not objective (directed toward God). Many thought there was no room for music like that in the church.
Jazz influences of the early twentieth century brought out an edict from the Pope that the piano was forbidden in the Catholic church, because of its worldly influences.
Soon after came the Jesus movement with drums, bass, guitars, and other instruments. Choruses and praise songs were following close behind and all of it was hotly debated in the church.
Over the years, there have been church and denominational splits, personal strife, and relationships broken causing those in the church to bitterly quarrel and those outside the church to look at the church with contempt.
Thanks Tovar for the article?
So what are we to conclude?
Surely one could not accurately describe Issac Watts by any of these descriptions
“This was written by a pastor in 1723 attacking Isaac Watts, the writer of great hymns like When I Survey the Wondrous Cross, Joy to the World, and O God, Our Help in Ages Past.”
Questions that arise…who was this Pastor, what was aceptable to this Pastor at the time if he despised Issac Watts compositions? Was the Pastor even a Christian?
My concern/s simply put is that it is arguing from the supposition that all music is God’s music.
I will look into it further.
Thanks again…
Worship Wars
on February 9 | in Feature, Uncategorized, Worship Styles, Worship Wars | by Kenny Lamm | with 9 Comments
(This is the first article of a 10-part series)
Take a look at this excerpt from an U.S newspaper objecting to the new trends in church music:
There are several reasons for opposing it.
One, it’s too new.
Two, it’s often worldly, even blasphemous.
The new Christian music is not as pleasant as the more established style.
Because there are so many songs, you can’t learn them all.
It puts too much emphasis on instrumental music rather than Godly lyrics.
This new music creates disturbances making people act indecently and disorderly.
The preceding generation got along without it.
It’s a money making scene and some of these new music upstarts are lewd and loose.
Does this sound like some of the “fan” mail you receive the week after you have pushed the envelope in worship with some new worship songs?
This was written by a pastor in 1723 attacking Isaac Watts, the writer of great hymns like When I Survey the Wondrous Cross, Joy to the World, and O God, Our Help in Ages Past.
You see, “worship wars” are nothing new to our decade. As long as we have had organized church and people with personal preferences, there has been conflict. As James 4:1 says,
What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don’t they come from your desires that battle with you?
You see, worship wars have been raging at least since around 700 a.d. Here are some highlights outlined by Steve Hamrick of the Illinois Baptist State Convention:
When the Gregorian Chant became the official music of the church, it was characterized by a single monophonic unaccompanied melody sung only by men. Later young boys with unchanged voices started singing with the men but their voices were displaced by an octave. There were many who objected. Later harmony was added to the music of the church but many were against it.
When Luther started writing hymns for the church in 1517 there was a great revolt.
In 1540 Calvin stated that only the Old Testament Psalms sung in a metrical rhythm were appropriate for worship (The Genevan Psalter). This caused great division among the church between Calvin’s followers and Luther’s.
Near 1750 the Wesley brothers wrote hymns that taught theology and doctrine. It again caused great struggle among church leaders.
The music of the 1880’s Sunday School Era was looked down on by many because the hymns and testimony songs being written were subjective (personal) and not objective (directed toward God). Many thought there was no room for music like that in the church.
Jazz influences of the early twentieth century brought out an edict from the Pope that the piano was forbidden in the Catholic church, because of its worldly influences.
Soon after came the Jesus movement with drums, bass, guitars, and other instruments. Choruses and praise songs were following close behind and all of it was hotly debated in the church.
Over the years, there have been church and denominational splits, personal strife, and relationships broken causing those in the church to bitterly quarrel and those outside the church to look at the church with contempt.
It was not a pastor, but many pastors and church leaders of the time who condemned his music. They condemned many of the “old” hymns that many of us grew up with as well. Many were condemned for sounding too much like the beer hall songs of the day. And, for that matter, if you look at the footnotes in some of the hymn books we use, often times it says they were indeed written to the tune of some popular secular tune of the time. Some said the music was too upbeat. There are many other examples. But, think of the countless men, women and children who have been saved down through the centuries and who have been uplifted and comforted due to the influence of those hymns. How can we say that countless more have not been saved and truly uplifted by the more modern praise and worship hymns as well?
What we can conclude is that you can’t judge a person’s heart and you certainly can’t judge whether the music or the lyrics was inspired by the Holy Spirit or not. How do we know for a fact that it was not Holy Spirit inspired without knowing the hearts of the writers and the musicians who composed it? The obvious conclusion is that we can’t.
You and the many people on this blog who agree with you are judging not just the music itself, but the hearts of the artists who write it, as well as the hearts of the kids who go to the conventions to hear it. One can have an opinion about words and music, but absolutely no one can judge a man’s heart but the Father. I know without a doubt that you feel that the Holy Spirit led you to write these blogs, so why do you and your followers feel led to criticize artists who feel that they are equally led by the Holy Spirit to write the lyrics and compose the music that they do? Are each of you so unbending in your beliefs and opinions that you feel all of you are right without question?
Thanks for taking the time to write and publish this article. I think your intention was not to condemn or judge but to warn the masses of the subtle changes that are occurring in the church and the music we imbibe as part of worship.
I actually found this article after listening to some of Hillsongs latest music as well as music from Bethel. I then did a random search on Google and stumbled across this article.
The music is very much trance-like and really does not impart life. The constant chimes in the background of many of these songs send a very eerie sense within, there is a soulish element to the latest music from these bands that appeases the flesh, very much like a good ol’ love song makes you feel lost in the moment.
This really reflects a self-fulfilling type of worship that is designed to make us feel good inside and isn’t separate from the music of the world. A Holy Spirit inspired song will always Glorify the Lord Jesus Christ and cause our focus to be on Him. The mark of a God centered song is its ability to bring you to a place of surrender and awe of our Creator, self is lost in the wave of God’s presence which responds to worship that is in Spirit and in Truth! God’s Word is Truth and His word will always be intertwined in our Worship to Him.
The new strategy (or perhaps the age old strategy of deception) seems to be to draw man to God by appeasing his flesh, by using the way of the world to entice the younger folk into giving Jesus a try. But the Bible says that the carnal/fleshly mind is hostile to God and in the Book of James we learn that friendship with the world is enmity to God… we become the enemies of God when we join ourselves to the ways of this world. We cannot use worldly principles and methods and even music to draw men to God. It is our Father in heaven who draws us to Him, the work of Salvation is spiritual and it cannot be manufactured by a man-made strategy or approach.
Singing and praising God is just one facet of what true worship is. A true worshiper is not someone who gets onto youtube and listens to the latest fad music, gets his emotional fix, says His Amens and then gets back to the grind feeling good inside. Paul gives us the best description of the true meaning of worship in Romans 12:1-2:
1. I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual WORSHIP. 2. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.
I think back to when I was a kid and the well known drama “Heaven’s Gates, Hell’s flames” was making its rounds in my city and many people were converted through this medium. I remember a few friends and myself went for one of these shows and we all gave our lives to Christ thereafter because we were soooo scared of going to hell and burning in these flames. But absolutely none of us had the slightest inkling in knowing Jesus thereafter, in fact, we all just went on with our lives doing as we pleased forgetting this prayer of repentance we made.
The seed that is sown in our hearts is God’s Word and it is this Word that takes root and brings us unto repentance, and all this is God’s work in us by His Spirit. Psalm 127:1 says: “Unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain.”
Man-made music will never sanctify anyone, neither will it bring us into maturity, but God’s Word will, His Spirit of Truth in us will, trusting in Him and leaning on Him and desiring to know Him more will see inner change and growth beyond anything the world has to offer. The pattern of the world and the things it offers is rooted in self-gratification but God’s Spirit teaches us and shapes us into beings that know and understand that is more blessed to give then it is to receive.
It’s not about the music we listen too, or the groups and individual who sings these songs, it is all about Jesus Christ! And the Lord Jesus said we would have to deny ourselves in order to follow Him. We can try and mix the world with Christ but He is not of this world — Jesus Christ does not mix with this world and its ways!!!
I write this response in Love, and the foundation of this Love is Jesus Christ! May the Holy Spirit leads us into all truth as we sincerely desire truth… Amen!
Hi Ash,
Thanks for the thoughtful response, and some excellent points
God bless
Have you listened to this song by Hillsong? This I Believe (The Creed)
Our Father everlasting
The all creating One
God Almighty
Through Your Holy Spirit
Conceiving Christ the Son
Jesus our Savior
I believe in God our Father
I believe in Christ the Son
I believe in the Holy Spirit
Our God is three in one
I believe in the resurrection
That we will rise again
For I believe in the name of Jesus
Our Judge and our Defender
Suffered and crucified
Forgiveness is in You
Descended into darkness
You rose in glorious life
Forever seated high
I believe in God our Father
I believe in Christ the Son
I believe in the Holy Spirit
Our God is three in one
I believe in the resurrection
That we will rise again
For I believe in the name of Jesus
I believe in You
I believe You rose again
I believe that Jesus Christ is Lord
I believe in God our Father
I believe in Christ the Son
I believe in the Holy Spirit
Our God is three in one
I believe in the resurrection
That we will rise again
For I believe in the name of Jesus
For I believe in the name of Jesus
For I believe in the name of Jesus
I believe in life eternal
I believe in the virgin birth
I believe in the saints’ communion
And in Your holy Church
I believe in the resurrection
When Jesus comes again
For I believe, in the name of Jesus
I believe in God our Father
I believe in Christ the Son
I believe in the Holy Spirit
Our God is three in one
I believe in the resurrection
That we will rise again
For I believe in the name of Jesus
For I believe in the name of Jesus
Hi Hanna
Yes I have heard the song. However please read my article
Hi Lance,
This I Believe is still a declaration to God of our faith in Him. When we sing this song, we are singing to Him that whatever happens in this world, we still believe in Him as our Lord and Saviour. In this article, you complain about how God and Jesus are never mentioned in the lyrics, but this song mentions the Trinity multiple times.
In this article, you also attacked Planetshakers. Have you listened to one of their latest songs, ‘I Know Who You Are’? It is a great declaration of our faith in God.
In the mountain air
In the valley low
You are always there
You are always close
I can feel Your grace
As You guide my steps
In the darkest place
I know who You are
Woah
Lord, Maker, Savior
I know that through it all
You are greater
Your love for me
Will never fade away
Those who hope in you
Will never be ashamed
‘Cause I know who You are
You have walked the earth
And you understand
You know every hurt
And You hold my hand
Though the storms may rage
They still know Your Name
Oh Jesus
I know who You are
Woah
I know who You are
Woah
Lord, Maker, Savior
I know that through it all
You are greater
Your love for me
Will never fade away
Those who hope in you
Will never be ashamed
I may not have much left
But you provide
With every waking breath
I’ll lift you high
You hear my every breath
You are by my side
God I know you
God I trust you
Oh Lord
I put my hope in You
‘Cause I know You
Lord, Maker, Savior
I know that through it all
You are greater
Your love for me
Will never fade away
Those who hope in you
Will never be ashamed
Cause I Know who You are, Jesus
I know who You are, Jesus (no one compares)
I know who You are
I can’t tell; Are you jealous OR Just under conviction? If Jealous, That goes under the root of Bitterness. If under conviction, I must ask myself WHY! It’s Either A.). Your not feeling the Holy Spirit moving on, nor touching YOUR HEART, OR. . . B.) You Possible sin in your life That Blocks any such experiences. (“I think Thou dost protest too much.”) (I Know, its not a bible verse but if the shoe fits. . . buy complimentary socks and hat. Sorry to be so harsh, but you’re acting like the Z/Jealous disciples who got mad because Someone Else was healing and preaching, AND IT WASN’T THEIR OWN CLIQUE! I’VE Got news for you, the signs of the times are all around; What Length will you go to to”Save Some? IF they aren’t living righteous lives, Fine, BUT Tell them in Love; Learn from even your “opponents, but don’t Condemn Them till YOU get the Beam out of your own eyes FIRST. MAY you learn the full meaning of applicable Evangelism, Becoming All things to all …To Save Some. The Psalms instructs us “TO SING A NEW SONG” and Enter into His Presence with SING-ING.
Dear 3rd Timotheus,
Firstly I am not sure WHO you are talking to, I am presuming the author, as you have failed in common courtesy.
Your question: Are you jealous OR Just under conviction?
Both….
Jealous
I am jealous for God’s name, and the insult that churches and ministries like Hillsong WHO make a mockery of the gospel, and blaspheme the name of God. The church is pouring energy into making her message popular, a message which is a forgery. These churches are nothing more than a McDonalds’ franchise. The gospel is nothing but a product. God is sold as a product to benefit our lives. To make our lives easier or better. But this is not the gospel. This is a sham. It’s a nice way to entertain and to ‘introduce’ Jesus. But again this is not the gospel.
Jesus said; ‘Unless you take up your cross and follow me, you cannot be my disciples’
Under conviction….yes. Why Timotheus aren’t you?
Under a conviction because we are all ashamed of the gospel.
Am I right before a holy God? Am I walking in the light?
I protest because there is a need to. To not to do so is to be like Peter, warming himself by the fire, and enjoying my comfortable life, and denying my Lord.
The signs of the times are all around;
Yes Correct – apostasy and a great falling away is happening in our day.
This is why there is this article, and others like it.
Becoming All things to all …To Save Some.
Yea right….the great lie, the greatest deception of our day.
Today, we say come as you are, but that doesn’t mean stay as you are! This quickly becomes the lowest common denominator. Anyone who finds the trappings of Christianity attractive, anyone who is comfortable with our presentation, anyone who comes to our modern churches, can seemingly do as they please, and make a commitment on their terms.
This philosophy is nothing new. Even Billy Graham’s close friend Chuck Templeton counselled him to keep moving with the times, because people no longer accepted the bible as inspired, so he needed to learn ‘the new jargon’ if he was to remain successful in ministry.
To illustrate this point further, Martyn Lloyd-Jones in one sermon during his Romans series, spoke of Woodbine Willie. Geoffrey Studdert Kennedy was a World War 1 Anglican chaplain who was heralded for his selflessness in the field of battle. However to ‘win some’ Woodbine Willie came up with some innovative ideas, one of which was to revert to smoking the soldiers cheap brand of cigarettes (Wild Woodbine), from which he got his nickname. In addition he took up swearing and cursing all as a means to win them to the gospel. ‘But the verdict of history on this was that it was a complete failure’
The early apostles preached the gospel. They didn’t use the tool of compromise to win some.
Wearing jeans, and sporting a tattoo, is nothing but the pollution of the saint, the ruination of the whole reason the gospel has power.
So in closing, if there was such a letter called 3rd Timothy, then it would be surely thrown out as heresy.
I definitely agree that tattoos are wrong, and that the occult symbols being used are concerning. Additionally, this world does seem to be getting further away from God, and many “Christians” being liberalized and secularized. They tolerate immorality and are too afraid of being “judgmental”, when in reality they are adopting doctrines of secular humanism by doing so. I also am aware of the evil of the illuminati and Wall Street, and everything relating to them.
But there are some questions that remain. I do not intend to cause an argument or anything, but I still have these concerns:
1. Are you saying that Contemporary Christian music is entirely bad? It may be in a contemporary genre, but it still is Christian. I don’t listen to metal or anything with witch codes like that.
2. Do you suppose some instances where this illuminati connection in Christian music is accidental and out of stupidity rather than malice?
3. In your rebuttal with Robin Taylor:
(” The room is black, the coloured lights flash all around” The room is not black..it is darkened so that people can feel comfortable worshiping God without feeling self conscious or looked at. Again, Hillsong wants the focus to be on God. The colored lights that flash around are there to celebrate the fact that our Savior lives!
Answer: Night Club, ….Night Club!!
1 Thessalonians 5:5
Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.)
Not that I am at all defending night clubs, but that scripture refers to spiritual light, not merely the physical. You took that scripture out of context.
4. In your rebuttal with robinrenee63:
“…Mormons, JWs, Islam, Seven Day Adventists, Roman Catholic…”
Certainly Mormons, JWs, and Muslims are NOT Christians nor saved, you are right. And I don’t know enough about Seventh-Day Adventists to really say about them. But with Roman Catholics is where you cross the line! Yes, some of their teachings are unscriptural (transubstantiation, good works salvation, purgatory, to name a few), but that does not mean all Catholics are unsaved. That would be an erroneous statement. I have Catholic family members who are Bible-believing Christians and are saved, whether you think they are or not. They don’t believe in purgatory or that salvation is by good works. They truly know that faith in Jesus Christ is the only Way, and they follow the Way. They probably are more Christian that simply Catholic, but it shows that Catholics can be children of God.
5. Ever though of this: many songs that may not outright say the word “God” also refer to Him in the second person, and are songs to God.
You aren’t condemning David Crowder or Fernando Ortega in your responses, are you? It’s bad enough you decide to trash Michael W Smith. And none of those three guys do rock or heavy metal!
6. You need to be less concerned over genre, and more over the message behind the song. Jimi Hendricks is not a legitimate prophet, and is not be the final authority over whether contemporary style music is okay or not. The Bible is. Where in the Bible does it say it has to be old hymns, and not be spiritual songs written in the present day? Why does it have to be a piano and an orchestra (not that there’s anything wrong with that), and it cannot be guitars and drums? And it doesn’t have to be done superficially either. And before you say anything about this verse:
“Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another with psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit. Sing and make music from your heart to the Lord,” (Ephesians 5:18-19 NIV).
Hymns is not the only thing there. There are also “psalms” and “songs of the Spirit”. or “spiritual songs”. It does not tell you which musical instruments you are allowed to play with.
7. Lastly, let me just warn you of something…
“9 But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless. 10 Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them. 11 You may be sure that such people are warped and sinful; they are self-condemned,” (Titus 3:9-11 NIV).
Neil
Hi Neil,
Thanks for your thoughts and concerns as to the worship of God in our times.
Our problem is we focus on the details. Our whole approach is wrong?
We need to step back and ask some important questions.
Where did the idea of dark auditoriums stem from?
Why about this idea of contemporary Christian music?
What is wrong with hymns? Are they really outdated?
Can our current songs being considered Hymns or spiritual songs, or are they more songs with a bit of christianeze, songs with Christian terminology?
Although we have had the enjoyment of many a good contemporary song, we must always review them based on the following criteria
1 — Foremost does it contain clear biblical doctrine that lines up with the core doctrines of the Christian faith?
2 — Does it teach us about God, and his character?
3 —Does it show or remind us of the condition of man in the light of who God is?
4 — Does the song give the gospel, talk of salvation themes like sin, corruption, man’s blindness, the cross, the blood , the resurrection, hope of eternal life?
5 — Does the melody distract, or induce worship?
6 — Does the music/musicians play for entertainment, for themselves, or for God’s glory?
7 – Does the whole thing ring true, or is it just making noise?
8 — Is the beat dominating and creating a barrier to worship in the proper sense?
1. Are you saying that Contemporary Christian music is entirely bad? It may be in a contemporary genre, but it still is Christian. I don’t listen to metal or anything with witch codes like that.
Answer:
Contemporary genre unfortunately even from its early days tended to deviate from alot of well established constructs.
Alot, not all but MOST modern worship is lite on doctrine, and have become 7/11 choruses, 7 lines sung 11 times.
2. Do you suppose some instances where this illuminati connection in Christian music is accidental and out of stupidity rather than malice?
Answer: Nooooo…maybe some ignorant christian’s, but some think its a natural part of appealing to the world, using the world’s symbols. But others have been given over to deception. DC Talk would be one example.
3. In your rebuttal with Robin Taylor:
1 Thessalonians 5:5
Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.)
“I am not at all defending night clubs, but that scripture refers to spiritual light, not merely the physical. You took that scripture out of context.”
Answer: What colour are the saints robes? White or black? [Rev 7:13 -14]
The trouble with the Modern Laodicean Church of this last 50 years is that we are happy with the near enough, the close enough, the religion that looks, tastes and smells like Christianity, but has is completely artificial, and hold to nothing of the genuine. But it suits our needs, our tastes, and our wants.
One of the key proponents of Christian songs being made contemporary was Rick Warren
He said “make the music what they are used to hearing on the radio – get rid of the organ.” All we have done is made the sinners more comfortable sitting through our church services.
We have decided that we can meet the sinner on his turf, and make a wager that somehow in all our accommodation to his standards this will bring an eventual window for the gospel. But this a cheap trick which has failed many a time in previous days.
“With Roman Catholics is where you cross the line!”
Answer: I think you have missed the point – Catholics are no different from Muslims or Mormons if they are not born again, saved by grace alone through faith alone.
“It’s bad enough you decide to trash Michael W Smith.”
Answer: I’m actually comparing David Crowder with Fernando Ortega.
Crowder plays the following genres Hillbilly rock,Christian rock, electronic rock, pop-punk, worship, bluegrass, alternative rock, folk rock.
I am trashing Michael because he allowed Christ hating bands at his venue. I would pull anyone up for it including the Pope.
Lastly, let me just warn you of something…
“9 But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law,”
Answer: To avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the LAW, is not the same as contend earnestly for the Truth
Lance Goodall,
Every Contemporary Christian song I listen to, there is a Christian theme in it and it does tell us the truth. And yes, even with bands you hate like David Crowder and Michael W Smith.
“I think you have missed the point – Catholics are no different from Muslims or Mormons if they are not born again, saved by grace alone through faith alone.”
Of course. Only being born again is one saved. But you can be a Catholic Christian, and still go to Heaven since you are a Christian. But Mormonism and Islam are different religions, and unlike Catholicism, are not branches of Christianity.
“What colour are the saints robes? White or black?”
Once again, you are cherry-picking throughout the Bible. The color someone’s robe was has nothing to do with the background color at a concert.
Now, concerning your questions at the top:
A. “Where did the idea of dark auditoriums stem from?”
Before the light bulb was invented, all auditoriums were dark! Even ones with hymns sung! Clearly all the torches and candles could not have lit up the room like modern technology can. It was not an “idea”.
B. “Why about this idea of contemporary Christian music?”
Just other musical genres that can be used to praise God instead of the devil. It is how you use something or respond to something that makes all the difference, not just the object itself.
C. “What is wrong with hymns? Are they really outdated?”
Nothing is wrong with hymns. But you should not denounce Contemporary Christian as a whole just because you are convinced of certain artists are unwittingly using satanic symbols (which, I agree, is terrible). You criticize contemporaries for focusing to much on what the music sounds like, yet you are doing the same thing!
“You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye,” (Matthew 7:5 NIV).
D. “Can our current songs being considered Hymns or spiritual songs, or are they more songs with a bit of christianeze, songs with Christian terminology?”
Of course songs can still be spiritual today, and of the Lord. The songs I listen to don’t just randomly throw Christian words in there. They actually have a Christian message behind it. I know the genre more anyway, since I listen to it regularly unlike you.
Now let’s look at your “criteria”:
1. “Foremost does it contain clear biblical doctrine that lines up with the core doctrines of the Christian faith?” (Yes it does. I always check the lyrics, and treat them as second-rate to what the Bible says; nonetheless, they are still biblical.)
2. “Does it teach us about God, and his character?” (It teaches us of everything the Bible says. It mentions God’s love, His holiness, Him as our Father and Creator, faith, perseverance, the Holy Spirit, and having joy and praise to Him, as well as many other things the Bible talks about).
3. “Does it show or remind us of the condition of man in the light of who God is?” (Yes. Like the Bible, it reminds us that we are sinners, in need of forgiveness and God’s grace. God is our loving, all-powerful, and holy Father who washes us from our sins and calls us His children when we follow Him.)
4. “Does the song give the gospel, talk of salvation themes like sin, corruption, man’s blindness, the cross, the blood , the resurrection, hope of eternal life?” (Yes, there is sin, the cross, Jesus’ blood shed for us, the resurrection, and eternal life. All of those themes have been included in many Contemporary Christian songs.)
5. “Does the melody distract, or induce worship?” (Not at all. As much as I really love it when the music sounds good, I still find it more important to focus on the words. I have noticed that compared to Contemporary Christian, secular songs are not very appealing. The songs that are not about God do not even sound attractive to me. Contemporary Christian has changed me that much. Secular songs sound like trash, but Christian songs, whether contemporary or more hymnal, sound better and are better.)
6. “Does the music/musicians play for entertainment, for themselves, or for God’s glory?” (They play for God’s glory. I have read/listened to stories behind writing each song, and also notes artists write on CDs giving God the credit and glory.)
7. “Does the whole thing ring true, or is it just making noise?” (It is not just noise. Following with my response to #5, I have noticed something in the music of Contemporary Christian music not found in secular songs. What I find is the Spirit of God, which makes it so much more beautiful. Not all Contemporary Christian songs are rock or really loud. There is a variety. Some sound more like country, others more like pop, rap, hip hop, and jazz, and even like hymns. Some contemporary artists do hymns from time to rime as well. There are many songs for praise and worship as well. I listen to a variety of types of Contemporary Christian, and find them all to be beautiful and godly.)
8. “Is the beat dominating and creating a barrier to worship in the proper sense? (No. The beat has not kept me from worshipping God, but it looks like it has kept you from doing so.)
So lastly:
“Our whole approach is wrong?”
Yes. While I am not at all against hymns, you are being too legalistic in many of these matters. You require people to listen to certain genres of music, and it cannot be too loud for you. It is such Pharisaic legalism from people like you that makes the worship dead and without the Spirit. Worship should be lively, and should excite us to praise the Lord.
Believe me, I even come across as rather legalistic in the eyes of many people, as I am very conservative and usually more worried about immorality and Laodiceanism that you are also concerned of. But to be honest, you seem to be beating around the bush. You have asked great questions we all should ask (Is this what God would want us to sing about?). Yet while many people seem to be not keen and discerning enough, you are being too hard on yourself and others.
“If you, LORD, kept a record of sins, Lord, who could stand?” (Psalm 130:3 NIV).
“He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the LORD require of you? To act justly and to love mercy and to walk humbly with your God,” (Micah 6:8 NIV).
“I am convinced, being fully persuaded in the Lord Jesus, that nothing is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for that person it is unclean,” (Romans 14:14 NIV).
I know that Contemporary Christian music in itself is not unclean, and I know my faith is strong enough to trust that it is godly music. But since you think it is clean, then fine. Then for you, it is unclean.
Dear Neil,
I will reply to most of your comments.
Every Contemporary Christian song I listen to, there is a Christian theme in it and it does tell us the truth.
Answer: Don’t give me fluff, as if all contemporary music is beautiful and wholesome. Its like singing the praises of Mcdonalds as healthy because they introduced a salad or fruit range to their menu.
And yes, even with bands you hate like David Crowder, and Michael W Smith.
Answer: I don’t hate these artists. Sorry to touch a nerve. Michael is punished for his lack of discernment in clearly choosing to have Christ hating bands at his Rockettown. Look it up for yourself. I have no respect for Crowder because he has taken the popular road of making music for money.
“I think you have missed the point – Catholics are no different from Muslims or Mormons if they are not born again, saved by grace alone through faith alone.”
Of course. Only being born again is one saved. But you can be a Catholic Christian, and still go to Heaven since you are a Christian. But Mormonism and Islam are different religions, and unlike Catholicism, are not branches of Christianity.
Answer: What happened to “come out of her my people, says the Lord?’ Shouldn’t a Christian be an ex Catholic, just like a Christian is an ex Mormon, as is a Christian an ex-Muslim? Since when did Transubstantiation sit only as a minor doctrinal issue. Men and Women have been martyred for refusing to hold to this doctrine of Rome.
“What colour are the saints robes? White or black?”
Once again, you are cherry-picking throughout the Bible. The color someone’s robe was has nothing to do with the background color at a concert.
Answer: So white robes aren’t symbolic of purity and light? And dark auditoriums aren’t a reflection of the hearts of the people? “And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.” – John 3:19
Now, concerning your questions at the top:
A. “Where did the idea of dark auditoriums stem from?”
Before the light bulb was invented, all auditoriums were dark! Even ones with hymns sung! Clearly all the torches and candles could not have lit up the room like modern technology can. It was not an “idea”.
Answer: But that was in the days of NO electricity – And if they had their Sunday morning service on a day of bright sunlight, then the light would have filtered into the church. They could have used more candles where they needed to. Yet we have electricity and all sorts of ways to illuminate an area, even using floodlights on a baseball pitch, but we turn the lights OFF in church?
B. “Why about this idea of contemporary Christian music?”
Just other musical genres that can be used to praise God instead of the devil. It is how you use something or respond to something that makes all the difference, not just the object itself.
Answer: Really? Your view of praising God is different from mine. Commercial Christian radio is an avenue for songs that hold or have commercial value. You cannot serve God and mammon.
C. “What is wrong with hymns? Are they really outdated?”
Nothing is wrong with hymns. But you should not denounce Contemporary Christian as a whole just because you are convinced of certain artists are unwittingly using satanic symbols (which, I agree, is terrible). You criticize contemporaries for focusing too much on what the music sounds like, yet you are doing the same thing!
“You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye,” (Matthew 7:5 NIV).
Answer: The original article ‘Hellsong’ is asking people to consider the extent of deterioration in a modern linguistics. I did not denounce Contemporary Christian as a whole. The song ‘Aftermath’ was the main focus, which was my major concern, and is clearly not Christian.
D. “Can our current songs being considered Hymns or spiritual songs, or are they more songs with a bit of christianeze, songs with Christian terminology?”
Of course songs can still be spiritual today, and of the Lord. The songs I listen to don’t just randomly throw Christian words in there. They actually have a Christian message behind it. I know the genre more anyway, since I listen to it regularly unlike you.
Answer: Yeah, but please enlighten me, as I think if you actually read the article it is showing concern for Hillsong in particular.
So far you Neil you are building an argument based on generalities.
Here’s one contemporary song which is full of Christian lyrics, mmm…well perhaps themes? You decide…
Hillsong Young and free – “Where You Are”
I lived
Heart on a wire
Hand in the fire for so long
But You’ve shown me better
A new kind of love
It’s ever the one I want
I’m lifting you higher, higher
There’s nothing that I’d rather do
A sweet elevation of praises
There’s no one I love more than You
I never knew a love like this before
The kind of life that I cannot find on my own
I’ve seen the world but I have never been so sure
That I want Your heart
God, I just want to be where You are
Where You are
I just want to be where You are
Your love, like nothing I’ve seen
My wildest of dreams don’t come close
Life never no better than living like this
I cannot resist You Lord
I’m lifting you higher, higher
There’s nothing that I’d rather do
A sweet elevation of praises
There’s no one I love more than You
I never knew a love like this before
The kind of life that I cannot find on my own
I’ve seen the world but I have never been so sure
That I want Your heart
God, I just want to be where You are
Where You are
I just want to be where You are
Where You are
I just want to be where You are
Neil, not sure if this makes it a Christian song….Christian lyrics? Pity the music video has shots of a girl and a guy so lots of mixed messages here. 4 references to God excellent!!
Check out my recent article
Now let’s look at your “criteria”:
1. “Foremost does it contain clear biblical doctrine that lines up with the core doctrines of the Christian faith?” (Yes it does. I always check the lyrics, and treat them as second-rate to what the Bible says; nonetheless, they are still biblical.)
Answer: Huh huh….
2. “Does it teach us about God, and his character?” (It teaches us of everything the Bible says. It mentions God’s love, His holiness, Him as our Father and Creator, faith, perseverance, the Holy Spirit, and having joy and praise to Him, as well as many other things the Bible talks about).
Answer: Not based on what I see in modern lyrics.
The only song of Hillsongs that fit that description recently was ‘This I believe (The Creed)’
3. “Does it show or remind us of the condition of man in the light of who God is?” (Yes. Like the Bible, it reminds us that we are sinners, in need of forgiveness and God’s grace. God is our loving, all-powerful, and holy Father who washes us from our sins and calls us His children when we follow Him.)
Answer: Sure … cause most contemporary songs are so good at explaining these themes like Hillsong’s — Oceans.
4. “Does the song give the gospel, talk of salvation themes like sin, corruption, man’s blindness, the cross, the blood , the resurrection, hope of eternal life?” (Yes, there is sin, the cross, Jesus’ blood shed for us, the resurrection, and eternal life. All of those themes have been included in many Contemporary Christian songs.)
Answer: So I should never have bothered with my article I guess cause we have so much beautiful quality christian music expounding the truths of God’s word out there.
5. “Does the melody distract, or induce worship?” (Not at all. As much as I really love it when the music sounds good, I still find it more important to focus on the words. I have noticed that compared to Contemporary Christian, secular songs are not very appealing. The songs that are not about God do not even sound attractive to me. Contemporary Christian has changed me that much. Secular songs sound like trash, but Christian songs, whether contemporary or more hymnal, sound better and are better.)
Answer: Most dogs don’t have fleas either
6. “Does the music/musicians play for entertainment, for themselves, or for God’s glory?” (They play for God’s glory. I have read/listened to stories behind writing each song, and also notes artists write on CDs giving God the credit and glory.)
Answer: Like Hillsong standing on the red carpet at last years 2015 AMA awards, loving being there, just soaking in the atmosphere. This is a worldly event!
7. “Does the whole thing ring true, or is it just making noise?” (It is not just noise. Following with my response to #5, I have noticed something in the music of Contemporary Christian music not found in secular songs. What I find is the Spirit of God, which makes it so much more beautiful. Not all Contemporary Christian songs are rock or really loud. There is a variety. Some sound more like country, others more like pop, rap, hip hop, and jazz, and even like hymns. Some contemporary artists do hymns from time to rime as well. There are many songs for praise and worship as well. I listen to a variety of types of Contemporary Christian, and find them all to be beautiful and godly.)
Answer: The Spirit of God will only bless Scriptural music which has clearly been identified in the list I gave. If it doesn’t marry up, you might be enjoying it, but the Holy Spirit isn’t.
8. “Is the beat dominating and creating a barrier to worship in the proper sense? (No. The beat has not kept me from worshipping God, but it looks like it has kept you from doing so.)
Answer: You must be listening to Maranatha Volume 5 to say that modern contemporary has no beat? Obviously this is a concern.
Newsboys perhaps…..
Which of these criteria does this song meet??
Or what about the chipmunks version?
So lastly:
“Our whole approach is wrong?”
Yes. While I am not at all against hymns, you are being too legalistic in many of these matters. You require people to listen to certain genres of music, and it cannot be too loud for you.
Answer: I’m trying to get people back to godly principles, and not songs for the flesh. Call it legalistic, but really if you think I must be only playing hymns in my car, and have never listened to contemporary Christian music, you are quite wrong. My challenge is turn this diet of music off, and work on finding music that truly edifies the Lord, not necessarily you.
“I am convinced, being fully persuaded in the Lord Jesus, that nothing is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for that person it is unclean,” (Romans 14:14 NIV).
I know that Contemporary Christian music in itself is not unclean, and I know my faith is strong enough to trust that it is godly music. But since you think it is clean, then fine. Then for you, it is unclean.
Answer: Sure — if you think so. Here’s another ‘cherry picked’ verse for you ‘Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!’ – Is 5:20
Rom 14:14 — The verse you gave is referring to food Neil. Read on…to the next few verses.
15 If your brother or sister is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy someone for whom Christ died.16 Therefore do not let what you know is good be spoken of as evil. 17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. – Rom 14: 15 – 17 NIV
So righteousness must guide our choices.
Otherwise I will head out to Christian sex party, cause I believe it’s clean for me.
I have never listened to “Aftermath”, your main focus, so I have no contradiction with you over that. I also do not listen to Hillsong, much, so I will have to look further into their song lyrics myself.
As for everything else you said:
“Don’t give me fluff, as if all contemporary music is beautiful and wholesome. Its like singing the praises of Mcdonalds as healthy because they introduced a salad or fruit range to their menu.”
I see you took “Christian” out of that, claiming I said all contemporary songs were good. You are TWISTING MY MESSAGE to make me sound worse than I really am. Obviously you did not read all of my last comment. I said all contemporary CHRISTIAN songs were beautiful, but I said secular contemporary songs were trash.
By the way, I have no fluff for you, and I never eat McDonald’s.
“I have no respect for Crowder because he has taken the popular road of making music for money.”
Proof for that assumption? Only God surely knows the hearts of men. You are judging someone’s motives when you have no actual proof that the person is using bad motives. David Crowder’s not the problem. The problem is with people like Justin Bieber, Rihanna, Miley Cyrus, Beyoncé, Jay-Z, etc. and other secular artists who are illuminati and are not Christians. Also, false teachers and prophets, heretics, and apostates in the church (especially preachers) are to watch out for.
“I don’t hate these artists…I have no respect for Crowder…”
You just contradicted yourself. Do you hate Crowder, or not? (You sound like you do, but then you say you don’t hate these artists.)
“Shouldn’t a Christian be an ex Catholic, just like a Christian is an ex Mormon, as is a Christian an ex-Muslim?”
Christians can be EX-Mormons, EX-JWs, and EX-Muslims. But you do not have to renounce Catholicism to be a Christian. Like I said before, I have people in my family who are Catholics and are Christians. They do not believe the heresies of transubstantiation, purgatory, and the like, and they know that Christianity is more important than what branch/denomination you are. You probably think they will go to hell just for being Catholics. I know they are followers of Jesus Christ (even though we see a lot of “Catholics” who really are not), and they will be in Heaven. But it does not look like they will see you at all.
“Since when did Transubstantiation sit only as a minor doctrinal issue. Men and Women have been martyred for refusing to hold to this doctrine of Rome.”
And likewise, Protestants have also persecuted Catholics and other types of Protestants in the past, whether it be Lutherans, Anglicans, Puritans, Calvinists, etc.
“So white robes aren’t symbolic of purity and light? And dark auditoriums aren’t a reflection of the hearts of the people? “And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.” – John 3:19”
So anyone who wears a black shirt goes to hell? Not at all what the Bible is saying. Darkness here refers to sin, and light means righteousness. If all you are concerned about is the color of the clothing someone wears, then you are being like the Pharisees.
“23 Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. 24 You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel,” (Matthew 23:23 NIV).
You worry too much about the genre and style, and not on what is truly important: the message behind it, and whether it is scriptural. You keep saying you are concerned about the words, but you still are treating the outward appearance as more important.
“But the Lord said to Samuel, ‘Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart,’” (1 Samuel 16:7 NIV).
About your recent article:
Not that I believe illuminati symbols are tolerable, but what was the thing in the first video, exactly, that you were concerned with, again?
As for the second video, let’s look at the lyrics to “Where You Are” by Hillsong and let me help you interpret it correctly:
Lyrics: “I lived heart on a wire hand in the fire for so long
But You’ve shown me better a new kind of love it’s ever the one I want.”
Meaning: I once lived a life full of sin, doing wrong, but God has lead me to something better: a life embracing His love and following Him.
Lyrics: “I’m lifting you higher, higher there’s nothing that I’d rather do
A sweet elevation of praises there’s no one I love more than You.”
Meaning: All I want to do is to exalt the Lord higher. I want to increase my praises to Him and love Him first.
Lyrics (Main Chorus): “I never knew a love like this before
The kind of life that I cannot find on my own
I’ve seen the world but I have never been so sure
That I want Your heart
God, I just want to be where You are
Where You are I just want to be where You are.”
Meaning: Never have I had anything in life greater than my love for God. I could never make it on my own. Now I am more sure than ever, that I want the Lord’s heart. I want to be where God is (in Heaven), and I want to go where He leads me.
Lyrics: “Your love, like nothing I’ve seen
My wildest of dreams don’t come close
Life never no better than living like this
I cannot resist You Lord.”
Meaning: God’s love is greater than anything I can see or imagine. Life is better when I follow the Lord. How can I resist that?
Lyrics: “And after all this time with You by my side
I can’t imagine what it’d be like on my own
I’ve made up my heart, this love is all I’ve got
And You’re the only one I know worth living for.”
Meaning: After being with God, I cannot believe I could have ever done it alone. I have decided to love and put my faith in Jesus, the only one worth living for and serving.
Conclusion: I hate to break it to you, but that absolutely is a Christian song because of the message behind the lyrics. It is about giving up the old life and following the Lord. It is about loving Him, and that He is the only one worth following. Only following Jesus gets us where God is, which is where we need to go.
As for “Oceans”:
Lyrics: “You call me out upon the waters the great unknown where feet may fail and there I find You in the mystery in oceans deep my faith will stand.”
Meaning: God is calling us to something too hard to do on our own. But my faith will remain even in troublesome circumstances.
Lyrics (Main Chorus): “And I will call upon Your name
And keep my eyes above the waves
When oceans rise my soul will rest in Your embrace
For I am Yours and You are mine.”
Meaning: I call out to God and make it through the challenges. I will be given rest in God, for I belong to Him.
Lyrics: “Your grace abounds in deepest waters
Your sovereign hand
Will be my guide
Where feet may fail and fear surrounds me
You’ve never failed and You won’t start now.”
Meaning: God’s grace is deep, and He will guide me. Even where people fall and where there is fear and doubt, God will never fail us, our faith will remain, and God will remain faithful to us.
Lyrics: “Spirit lead me where my trust is without borders
Let me walk upon the waters wherever You would call me
Take me deeper than my feet could ever wander
And my faith will be made stronger in the presence of my Savior.”
Meaning: Holy Spirit, lead me so that I may have complete faith. Let me be able to go down the right path, even when it is difficult. Take me deeper into my faith in God, who enables me to do what I cannot do alone.
Conclusion: Yes, this is a Christian song. It is about God leading us through the difficulties in life, and that we will make it through if we trust Him. As followers of Him, we belong to Him, and He will lead us the right way and to where we need to be.
“Most dogs don’t have fleas either.”
Yes, but some dogs also have rabies. But the “dogs” that reject the Lord God are worse than that. I have put my faith in Him, though, so I am not one of those dogs.
“The Spirit of God will only bless Scriptural music which has clearly been identified in the list I gave.”
Oh, so only you have the truth about how godly songs actually are? Are you so righteous that only you know the truth? I beg to differ!
“3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, 4 they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions 5 and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain,” (1 Timothy 6:3-5 NIV).
Now you are right, then, that artists should not be doing this for money. But look at verses 3-4. Do not go down that road.
“If it doesn’t marry up, you might be enjoying it, but the Holy Spirit isn’t.”
I know that the Holy Spirit is pleased with Christian music, whether it be hymnal or contemporary. I have recently received Holy Spirit baptism, and the Holy Spirit has not told me not to listen to Contemporary Christian music.
“You must be listening to Maranatha Volume 5 to say that modern contemporary has no beat?”
I never said a song had no beat. You’re twisting my words again! But the beat in Contemporary Christian songs has not distracted me from what the song is truly saying. I have never even heard of “Maranatha Volume 5”.
“God’s Not Dead” fits the descriptions of a godly Christian song, too. It is about how God is not dead, or inactive or nonexistent, as many people believe. God is living inside of us, since God comes inside of us when we accept Jesus as Lord. We are to love God and be bold about our faith, since God is alive and active. We shall fight the darkness (relying on God of course) and have a faith that is alive and active. The third part of the song is calling out to God for a spiritual revival.
I’m not sure what is up with the chipmunks’ version.
“Sure — if you think so. Here’s another ‘cherry picked’ verse for you ‘Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!’ – Is 5:20”.
I was never promoting moral relativism in any way when I mentioned Romans 14:14, but I know contemporary CHRISTIAN music is not sinful. I am not calling evil “good”, but you are calling good “evil”.
“So righteousness must guide our choices. Otherwise I will head out to Christian sex party, cause I believe it’s clean for me.”
Oh, you like to go to “Christian” sex parties now? Now you go from legalism to Laodiceanism.
Yes, righteousness must guide our choices, but not our own righteousness. God’s righteousness should guide us. Therefore, I listen to Contemporary Christian music.
“I’m trying to get people back to godly principles, and not songs for the flesh. Call it legalistic, but really if you think I must be only playing hymns in my car, and have never listened to contemporary Christian music, you are quite wrong. My challenge is turn this diet of music off, and work on finding music that truly edifies the Lord, not necessarily you.”
Oh, so now you’re “struggling” to be weaned off of this “sinful” music that is CHRISTIAN, but contemporary. Then why are you trying to tell people what genres of music they should listen to when you cannot even keep your own life in order! Obviously you are relying on your own strength and not on God.
“So I should never have bothered with my article I guess cause we have so much beautiful quality christian music expounding the truths of God’s word out there.”
That’s right. This article does not advance the Kingdom of God. While there are many artists that are very ungodly and are of the devil, most if not all Contemporary Christian artists are not wolves, nor are they wolves in sheep’s clothing.
You say you are doing this to lead people to God, yet that is not the case.
If that is your true intention, though, I appreciate that you are trying to warn people about the wickedness of this world and that you intend to lead them to the right Way. But what you are doing is not how you bring people to the Truth. You should not worry so much about what genre or style of music people listen to, just that it is appropriate and about God and Christianity (not in a negative light, of course). Focus more on preaching the Word of God, the good news of Jesus Christ, on strengthening people’s faith, and on receiving the Holy Spirit.
Otherwise, I can tell that you are not truly working to advance the Kingdom of God. You are only doing this, then, to make Christianity look bad by spewing hate from your flesh, and maliciously attacking people that listen to Christian music, just not your kind. We are supposed to hate sin, but not hate other people.
“Hatred stirs up conflict, but love covers over all wrongs,” (Proverbs 10:12 NIV).
“Whoever claims to love God yet hates a brother or sister is a liar. For whoever does not love their brother and sister, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen,” (1 John 4:20 NIV).
and that ended the conversation…
God bless you people. We can be right or wrong with our thoughts and comments but at the end of the day it’s between our hearts and the heart of God.
You do know that a song sung to the Lord is for GOD and not us right? Worship is supposed to be a private, intimate and extremely special time with GOD! IT is not a case of what your ears can stand to hear. IT is showing complete obedience and service to GOD!
GOD has Order in his kingdom! HE has his chosen, his children, his apostles 12, his heads of Israel, his High priests. Worship is about coming into the LORD GOD’s Presence according to his will, not your own. Just like everything else GOD has showed us how HE wants US to worship him.
If we don’t worship GOD as he commanded, how can we say we are children of the kingdom? How can we say we are children of obedience, servants to his will? Worship is a Key to the Kingdom. Without calling the right number, how can you expect the right person to answer the phone? The same goes for worship. Who exactly are you worshipping and why?
Kanye, Jay-z, Beyonce’and the Like, Hillsong and other so-called Christian [Demon]inations (denominations) that worship in concert defies GOD’s instruction of Worship. Therefore, why would GOD be listening? They Blaspheme our LORD GOD and smile about it, they are not children of the Kingdom.
You may say “thou shalt not judge”, but it is the spirit i am Judging not the Flesh. And i know that i will be Judged according to the same measure. IT Angers me to see my GOD ridiculed by those that do not know him. It infuriates me to see my GOD Mocked by the Likes of these people.
Fear the Wrath of the LORD of HOSTS for the great and Dreadful Day of the LORD comes quickly. Then the children of the Wicked will see the Glory of our Supreme Lord Jesus Christ and they will know suffering. Their time is short for My LORD GOD comes like a thief in the night, But even still, Come LORD JESUS.
Hi Hannah,
Thanks for your thoughts
Unfortunately the planetshakers song is a watered down version of I believe, based on the Apostles Creed, but ‘I know who you are’ because it mentions Jesus we are to give it sweeping praise and a tick of approval.
What about their other recent songs like momemtum?
Hi Lance, ‘I know who You are’ is in no way a watered down version of ‘This I Believe’. One of your main arguments about how modern Planetshakers and Hillsong song are ‘bad’ is that they don’t mention Jesus. When I find songs that do mention Him and speak only of glorifying and thanking Him, you say that we shouldn’t give the song a ‘tick of approval’ just because it mentions Jesus. Did you read all of the lyrics? I can see no problem with people singing these songs that glorify the Lord, although you obviously can’t accept any recent songs by Hillsong or Planetshakers as worthy of singing to Him.
I assume your problem with ‘Momentum’ is the word ‘party’? There is nothing wrong with dancing, singing and having a party to praise Jesus, just as King David danced and sung for the Lord. Do you have a problem with that? Or that the Angels in Heaven rejoice (and presumable party, by dancing and singing with JOY) when a sinner repents? I don’t think God has a problem with people partying and getting excited and happy if they are doing it for Him.
Hi Hannah,
Here are the lyrics for the song ‘Momentum’ which would have got David’s toes tapping.
I can see it coming, a wave of His power
You won’t find me running, ‘cause this is the hour
That I am going deeper
To places that I’ve never been
I believe for greater
To see things that I’ve never seen
Our God is moving and His love is unstoppable
So keep the party going, no stopping
Caught up in momentum
Not sure how this is sufficient to make the grade as a christian worship song, except to say that we are happy with entertainment, and feel good music.
This is all really sad…simply put, our relationship with God is between us and Him, it really doesnt matter how you get there, as long as you get there. I listen to Hillsong, I dont know their names or care about what they are wearing…what I do care about is songs that can bring you to your knees, weeping because of how much He loves us, and how much we do not deserve the love He gives us..when you go to the point of disecting someones life and trying to find evil, I do not believe we are here to judge…matter of fact its a pretty dangerous path to take, attacking God’s children….you do not know their hearts and neither do I , but I would rather not tread on those grounds. God Bless-
Kelley,
I have read back over your comment
“This is all really sad…simply put, our relationship with God is between us and Him, it really doesnt matter how you get there, as long as you get there.”
Let me guess you are happy with a gospel that offers salvation in the end without defning what that gospel is.
This sounds like you been watching too much of Oprah.
Praise God’s Son Jesus Christ
The devil’s ministers in sheep’s clothing subtly teach people to call upon “another Jesus” (2 Cor. 11:4) instead of always upon God’s Son Jesus Christ through his name as commanded by Jesus (1 John 3:23, John 14:6, 14-15, 1 John 5:13-14):
“The leaven in the music of Hillsong United” – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcGviKVRV94
May the blessing of God’s Son Jesus Christ be upon all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ (1 Cor. 1:2).
I have read the lyrics to a lot of hillsong music like cornerstone , if you take the music for what it is and for get the church’s doctrine and what they believe , you would say cornerstone was a beautiful Christian song., in the bible God as used ungodly for his purpose.
David,
From your comments I assume you are saying that any song can be a christian song, as long as it sounds christian, and Hillsong is being used by God for his purposes even though they are ungodly.
“The book of the same name tackles these issues head on:”
Lance, as I read these comments, I am saddened by many of the responders’ superficial understanding of God. True Christians are to “contend for the faith,” “be watchmen on the wall,” “rightly divide the Word of Truth.” It seems they like what they like, and are not concerned with your discernment about modern “Christianity” becoming more like the world, than like Jesus Christ. There is an absence of a quest for holiness. The church-goers of today do not know the Word. And too many spend most of their time telling others not to judge, which has become the new-age church single doctrine. Aren’t they judging?
In context, the Bible does not tell us not to judge; it tells us how to judge. We cannot point to a lie, if we are lying.
I Peter 4:17 – For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house (the church) of God.
16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
Proverbs 4:23 – Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.
In the last days…
II Tim. 3:2 – people will be lovers of themselves
Ii Tim. 4:2-3 – 2Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. 3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears.
If true Bible Believers will not contend for the faith, and warn the church of apostasy (falling away), who will?
I will take it a step further, the reason the “church” is only concerned about not being judged, rather than pursuing holiness as a good soldier of Jesus Christ, is because the people have been given a new gospel for the past 100 years, a gospel that has been stripped of repentance of sin and stripped of following Jesus (disciple). It is purely secular.
People reveal who they are by asking the wrong question, “Why are you judging?” When if they loved Jesus Christ and His precepts, they should be asking, “How can I be more like Him,and less tainted by the world?” We are in the last days.
Hi Blantant
Thanks Blantant for your thoughts and c oncerrn.
2 Tim 3:13 applies here;
But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.